AVX to INFINITY

Discuss chronologies for characters in the main "Marvel Universe"

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AVX to INFINITY

Post by Col_Fury » Mon Jun 01, 2015 5:17 am

AvX: Consequences through Punisher War Zone v3 were laid out in the Wolverine Index. The rest of this is from what the MCP has for Storm’s chronology.

Fair warning, we’re into the period where I haven’t read a good portion of these comics yet. I’m getting caught up, but I’m definitely behind.

AVENGERS vs. X-MEN
AvX: Consequences 1 (1 - 4)
Captain Marvel v8 1
Daredevil v3 12-16
Avengers v4 31-34
New Avengers v2 31-34
Avengers v5 2-FB
A+X 1/2
X-Men: Legacy v2 1-6
Hawkeye v5 6
Astonishing X-Men v3 57-58
Winter Soldier 10-14
Avengers Assemble 9-11
A+X 4/2-FB
Avengers v5 1-5
Uncanny Avengers 1-4
AvX: Consequences 1 (5 - 20), 2-5
Wolverine v2 314-317
Punisher War Zone v3 1-5
-Dr. Octopus becomes Spider-Man-
Avenging Spider-Man 16
X-Men v2 40-41
All-New X-Men 1-8
Wolverine & the X-Men 24
Uncanny X-Force v2 1-6
X-Men: Legacy v2 11
Scarlet Spider v2 17-18
X-Men v3 1-2
Wolverine & the X-Men 27-31
All-New X-Men 9-10 / UX2 4 / All-New X-Men 11
Fearless Defenders 5-6
Wolverine & the X-Men 32-35
Astonishing X-Men 63
Wolverine v5 7
INFINITY


Stuff that needs to be included:

A+X #1-???
Age of Ultron #10AI
All-New X-Men #12-???
Amazing Spider-Man #692-700
Astonishing X-Men v3 #59-62, 64-68
Avengers v5 #6-13
Avengers Academy #35-39
Avengers AI #1-6
Avengers Arena #1-18
Avengers Assemble #12-13, 16-17
Avenging Spider-Man #9-15, 17-22
Cable & X-Force #1-19
Captain America v6 #15-19
Captain America v7 #1-???
Captain Marvel v8 #2-14
Daredevil v3 #17-???
Dark Avengers #175-190
Deadpool v5 #1-???
Fantastic Four #609-611
Fantastic Four v4 #1-???
Fearless Defenders #1-4, 7-9
FF #21-23
FF v2 #1-???
Gambit v5 #1-17
Guardians of the Galaxy v3 #1-7
Hawkeye v5 #1-???
(red) Hulk #53-57
Indestructible Hulk #1-15
Iron Man v6 #1-16
Journey Into Mystery #642-655
Mighty Thor #18-22
Morbius v2 #1-9
New Avengers v3 #1-7
New Mutants v3 #50
Nova v5 #1-???
Red She-Hulk #58-67
Savage Wolverine #1-???
Scarlet Spider v2 #5-16, 19-???
Secret Avengers #29-37
Secret Avengers v2 #1-9
Spider-Men #1-5
Superior Spider-Man #1-???
Superior Spider-Man Team-Up #1-2
Thor: God of Thunder #1-???
Thunderbolts v3 #1-13
Uncanny Avengers #5-22
Uncanny X-Force v2 #7-17
Uncanny X-Men v3 #1-???
Venom v2 #22-???
Winter Soldier #1-9, 15-19
Wolverine v5 #1-6, 8-???
Wolverine v6 #1-???
Wolverine & the X-Men #21-23, 25-26, 36-40
X-Factor #246-???
X-Men v3 #3-???
X-Men: Legacy v2 #7-???
X-Treme X-Men v2 #7.1-13
Young Avengers v2 #1-15
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Michael » Mon Jun 01, 2015 6:43 am

We had a huge discussion about Strange and whether it was Ock or Peter in New Avengers 34:
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=6952&start=15

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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Clive_Reston » Tue Jun 02, 2015 6:01 pm

For what it's worth, New Avengers v3 #1-3 must happen sometime before Avengers v5 #1 (when Steve wakes up at the beginning of A5 #1, he's having a momentary flashback to the end of NA3 3).

Also, don't forget Iron Man: Fatal Frontier, which happens more or less concurrently with Gillen's Iron Man #18-22.

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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Paul Bourcier » Tue Jun 02, 2015 8:32 pm

I'll try to start plodding through this in a methodical fashion. It may take a while.

First up, A+X. This is an anthology series and we don't need to assume that the issues happen in chronological order if that doesn't work.

A+X #16 occurs in the past. Spidey's here with Psylocke, Cyclops, Gambit, Wolverine, and Beast.

A+X #1/2 is a one-night story that must occur after A4 34 and may occur after Indestructible Hulk #1.

According to an editor's note, the Thing appears in A+X #6/2 (a one-day story) before FF4 1.

A+X #4/2 is a one-day story that must occur before UA 1 and likely before A5 1. I based this on Cap's barely modified costume here, but we may find that Cap was in a Wasp phase at this time, wearing variations of his costume.

A+X #2 (1-9) occurs 30 days before A+X #2 (10). Because Rogue is an Avenger, this story must begin after UA 4.

A+X #2/2 is a one-day story that occurs a couple of months after W&X 7.

A+X #3 is a one-day story that must occur after W&X 19 since Storm is noted as being at the Jean Grey School.

A+X #3/2 is a one-day story with no in-story placement clues that I can see.

A+X #4 is a one-day story that must occur before ASM 695 since Parker is Spidey.

A+X #5 is a one-night story with no in-story placement clues that I can see.

A+X #5/2 is a one-day story with no in-story placement clues that I can see.

A+X #6 is, yup, a one-day story with no in-story placement clues that I can see.

A+X #7 is a one day story. Beast is mutated here, so it must occur after All-New X-Men #8. This is the first time Stark has seen the mutated McCoy. Iron Man must appear here before UX3 2 since he's in space in All-New X-Men #11.

A+X #7/2 is, sigh, a one-day story with no in-story placement clues that I can see.

A+X #8 is...yeah ditto.

A+X #8/2 is a 2-day story with no in-story placement clues that I can see.

A+X #9 is a one-day story. Cap is in his costume with shoulder stars here.

AX #9/2 is a one-day story with no in-story placement clues that I can see.

A+X #10 is a one-day story with no in-story placement clues that I can see.

A+X #10/2 is a one-night story with no in-story placement clues that I can see.

A+X #11 is a one-day story with no in-story placement clues that I can see.

A+X #11/2 is a one-day story that must occur after Superior Spider-Man #13.

A+X #12 is a 2-day story. Since Simon Williams and the mutated Hank McCoy haven't seen each other before UA 9, this story would have to occur after UA 23, but that can't be right since Wonder Man is trapped in Rogue's mind after that point. So this story has to occur before UA 7 and we'll have to explain why the two act like they haven't seen each other in UA 9.

A+X #12/2 is a one-day story with no in-story placement clues that I can see.

A+X #13/2 is a one-day story with no in-story placement clues that I can see.

MODOK must appear in the one-day A+X #14 before SECA3 8 (12-14)-FB.

A+X #15 is a one-day story with no in-story placement clues that I can see.

A+X #17 is, you guessed it, a one-day story with no in-story placement clues that I can see.

A+X #18 is the same.

A+X #13, A+X #14/2, A+X #15/2, A+X #16/2, A+X #17/2, and A+X #18/2 constitute a one-day story. Again, no in-story placement clues that I can see.
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Paul Bourcier » Tue Jun 02, 2015 9:02 pm

Col_Fury, let's incorporate information from the "Wolverine's recent chronology" thread
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=9336&p=46277&hilit=Wolverine#p46277, assuming that more clues in the last several months haven't changed things.
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Col_Fury » Tue Jun 02, 2015 9:03 pm

I'll hopefully take a look at this tonight. Thanks!
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Col_Fury » Tue Jun 02, 2015 10:08 pm

Well, it looks like almost all of the discussion in that thread starts after the INFINITY crossover. Oops!

However, we know Wolverine loses his healing factor before INFINITY (he's powerless in INHUMANITY, which happens directly after INFINITY), so Uncanny Avengers 7-22 (where Wolverine still has his powers) happens before INFINITY as well.

Uncanny X-Force v2 is tied to Uncanny Avengers because of Storm (she makes a cameo in UA while in LA, which is where UXFOR v2 takes place), and if I remember right, that entire volume happens in a very short amount of time. I'll have to double check, but doesn't Cable & X-Force cross over with UXFOR v2 at the end of both of their runs, and that crossover happens very shortly after the main story ends in UXFOR v2?

I'm in the middle of reading Winter Soldier, and can say WSOL 1-5 happens over a few days, and happens after Doom returns from his exile in FF 611 and while Kristoff is still running Latveria. WSOL 6 starts in the week after WSOL 5's end (that's as far as I've gotten so far).

-edit-

WSOL 7 picks up "2 months" (!) after WSOL 6's end, and WSOL 7-14 takes about a week. Cap appears in his classic suit.
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Paul Bourcier » Wed Jun 03, 2015 6:18 am

Col_Fury wrote:
Well, it looks like almost all of the discussion in that thread starts after the INFINITY crossover. Oops!
A chunk of that chronology does occur before Infinity, and we need to revisit the whole mess we left months ago, including Rogue's chronology post-UA 22. Also, I have Battle of the Atom before Infinity and Agent Felix places BOTA after Infinity. My reasoning is that Logan still has his healing factor in most of BOTA and he doesn't in INHUMANITY. (I reckon Logan lost his power between pages 28 and 29 of X:BOTA 2 and that it took a while for Kitty to decide to leave the school.) Then there's the whole matter of the placement of BOTA relative to UA 7-22, also noted in that thread.

Should we pick up the X-Men dialog in that thread? I can continue to poke at non-X titles during the AVX-Infinity period in this thread.
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Col_Fury » Wed Jun 03, 2015 4:50 pm

Battle of the Atom was published during INFINITY. Meaning, INFINITY started before Battle of the Atom and finished after Battle of the Atom. Publication order doesn't help us here.

It's tempting to focus on just the X-books, but the problem is there's no big red flag that I've seen yet in the X-books as to where INFINITY takes place. There's a Wolverine & the X-Men Annual that ties in, but that's not the same as the ongoing series having tie-in issues, you know? (-edit- Oops! UX3 15 is an INHUMANITY tie-in)

I'll dig a little deeper, but in the meantime:

WSOL 15-19 happens over a few days, and starts as close or as far from WSOL 14 as we want it to (as long as Winter Soldier doesn't make any appearances between 14-15 elsewhere).
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Somebody » Wed Jun 03, 2015 4:58 pm

Paul Bourcier wrote:A chunk of that chronology does occur before Infinity, and we need to revisit the whole mess we left months ago, including Rogue's chronology post-UA 22. Also, I have Battle of the Atom before Infinity and Agent Felix places BOTA after Infinity. My reasoning is that Logan still has his healing factor in most of BOTA and he doesn't in INHUMANITY. (I reckon Logan lost his power between pages 28 and 29 of X:BOTA 2 and that it took a while for Kitty to decide to leave the school.)
Wait, wasn't there a scene with Wolverine getting stabbed and needing external help to heal before that?

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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Paul Bourcier » Wed Jun 03, 2015 9:10 pm

You called it, Somebody! There's an explicit reference to Logan's missing healing factor in X-Men v4 #6, one of the Battle of the Atom issues. Thanks for pointing that out.

That also means that Savage Wolverine #13 can't occur "just before" Battle of the Atom, as Logan still has his healing factor in that issue (he carves his own face off) and so the entirety of W5 1-13, W6 1-FB, and possibly DOW 1-FB -- the Logan loses healing factor saga that spans several weeks -- need to occur between between Savage #13 and BOTA 1.
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Mikhail » Thu Jun 04, 2015 9:55 am

Col_Fury wrote:Uncanny X-Force v2 is tied to Uncanny Avengers because of Storm (she makes a cameo in UA while in LA, which is where UXFOR v2 takes place), and if I remember right, that entire volume happens in a very short amount of time. I'll have to double check, but doesn't Cable & X-Force cross over with UXFOR v2 at the end of both of their runs, and that crossover happens very shortly after the main story ends in UXFOR v2?
UXFOR v2 has some rather wonky timeflow that needs to be open to interpretation. The entire run could arguably happen in a single night. There are four "stories" in the series:

Act 1 -Opening encounter with Bishop (#1-5)
Act 2 -Psylocke and Cluster leave to rescue Fantomex (#6-9)
Act 3 -Psylocke returns for finale against Owl Queen (#10-15)
Act 4 -Vendetta crossover (#16-17)

In Act 1, Psylocke is sent on a mission by Wolverine, joined by Storm, meets their contact Puck, and fights with Spiral, then Bishop. By the end, Spiral is their prisoner and Bishop is quasi-comatose after the Owl Queen Revenant escapes his mind and runs free. All happens in a matter of hours.

During Act 2, Psylocke goes to rescue Fantomex, and Spiral escapes. Psylocke's side mission could take place in less than 24 hours, and there's no indication Storm and Puck do anything other than squat in an abandoned building with Bishop's comatose form.

Act 3 has Psylocke's return, Bishop wakes up, and leads directly into the final encounter with the Owl Queen. All happens in one night...except for the Spiral solo issue, #12, which indicates that she has been searching for her friend Ginny for days, possibly weeks, since escaping Puck and Storm in #6 and before reuniting with them in #13. Act 3 ends with Bishop learning that Storm messed with his memories back in #5-6, ready for a confrontation.

Act 4 starts with that confrontation between Bishop and Storm, and the series concludes with the two X-Forces crossover. However, the group also seems to have discovered a full headquarters, team uniforms, and equipment in between #15 and #16.

For continuity purposes, the X-Force team never disbands on-panel. In the finale of Vendetta, Cable and Psylocke are discussing the future of X-Force, but the two teams still exist separately at that point.

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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Col_Fury » Thu Jun 04, 2015 2:38 pm

Thanks, Mikhail!

I'd say UXFOR2 1-15 happens over a few days, with the bulk of that time passing between issues 6 & 13 (thanks to Spiral), while Storm and Puck twiddle their thumbs. UXFOR2 16-17 probably starts the day after that (I had figured reading it at the time that Storm & co. finally had a chance to change their clothes; maybe they raided one of Wolverine's safe houses? It's not like they were sent to LA to relocate there, Psylocke was just sent on a quick mission and happened to be joined by the others).

If I recall correctly, the Cable & X-Force series probably happens in a fairly short amount of time as well. There are probably more breaks in the action, but wasn't the point of Cable forming that team that he was getting visions of the future and all this stuff was happening so close together that he couldn't handle it all himself, so he needed the team so they could split up? Putting too much time between missions kind of destroys that part of the series, I would think. And then of course, issues 18-19 cross over with UXFOR2 16-17.

Also, the Uncanny Avengers appear in Cable & X-Force, so those C&XFOR issues need to happen before UA 7, right?
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Col_Fury » Fri Jun 05, 2015 12:20 am

C&XFOR 1-4-FB happens a few days before C&XFOR 1-4, which happens in one day; the Uncanny Avengers appear. C&XFOR 5 happens the day after that.

C&XFOR 6 seems to start the day after C&XFOR 5, three days pass during the issue, Shadowcat appears with the Jean Grey School, “X-Face” Cyclops also appears, but no mention of what he’s up to. C&XFOR 7-10 happen on the same day that C&XFOR 6 ends on.

C&XFOR 11 happens in under an hour, probably the same day as C&XFOR 10. C&XFOR 12-14 all happens in one day, the day after C&XFOR 11. The Uncanny Avengers finally stop chasing Cable for what happened back in issues 1-4-FB.

C&XFOR 15-17 happens in one day, shortly after C&XFOR 14. There’s no definite amount of time stated, and in theory they could have been going on unseen missions between issues.

C&XFOR 18-19 crosses over with UXFOR2 16-17; again, it’s not specified how long it’s been since C&XFOR 17.

Wolverine appears with the Uncanny Avengers in C&XFOR 1-14, and also appears in UXFOR2’s early issues at the Jean Grey School.

Putting C&XFOR and UXFOR2 together, we’re looking at:

C&XFOR 1-14
UXFOR2 1-12
C&XFOR 15-17
UXFOR2 12-15
C&XFOR 18-19 / UXFOR2 16-17

And it all happens in a little over a week. Also, Storm, Psylocke, Puck, Spiral and Bishop all appear in Uncanny Avengers #11, in LA (it’s a quick little cameo). They’re only in LA, in that grouping, for a few days, so UA 7-22 happens during this week. Also, CA7 1-11 (there has to be a break in CA7 somewhere) is referenced in UA 7-22 as a few days ago.

In UXFOR2 17, Psylocke mentions that Storm and Wolverine are seeing each other, so sometime after W&X 24. So:

W&X 24
C&XFOR 1-14
UXFOR2 1-12
C&XFOR 15-17
CA7 1-11
UXFOR2 12-15
UA 7-22
C&XFOR 18-19 / UXFOR2 16-17

Fun!
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Col_Fury » Fri Jun 05, 2015 4:29 am

JiM 646 (1-5) is an epilogue to the Thor 18-22 /JiM 642-645 crossover. JiM 646 (6-20) happens sometime after that (the story doesn't say time passes, but because of later issues, there has to be a gap somewhere). JiM 647-650 happens in fairly short order after that. Spider-Man (Octavius) appears in JiM 648-649 (see?). Also in JiM 649: Monica Rambeau (so before she changes her name again in Mighty Avengers, so before INFINITY), Iron Man (voice only, no mention if he's in space), Hellcat and Namor.

JiM 651 is a one-night adventure. Thor appears. No mention of how long it's been since last issue.

JiM 652-655 happens over a day or three; Iron Man appears while he's in space. No mention of how long it's been since last issue.
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