AVX to INFINITY

Discuss chronologies for characters in the main "Marvel Universe"

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Col_Fury
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Col_Fury » Tue Jun 23, 2015 3:46 am

This is where we're at:

AVENGERS vs. X-MEN
AvX: Consequences 1 (1 - 4) (before Xavier’s funeral)
Captain Marvel v8 1 (Carol becomes Captain Marvel)
SECA 29-37
(red) HULK 53-57
CA6 15-18
Daredevil v3 12-16 (Carol already Captain Marvel) (Wasp still “dead”) (Doom not back yet)
FF 610 / F.F. 22
AACAD 38-39
CA6 19
Avengers v4 31-34 (Wasp returns)
Mighty Thor 18-22 / JiM 642-645, 646 (1-5)
New Avengers v2 31-34 (Carol already Captain Marvel)
UA 1-4 (Uncanny Avengers form) (Xavier’s funeral)
AvX: Consequences 1 (5 - 20), 2-5 (Carol already Captain Marvel)
XXX2 7.1
HAWK5 7 (Kate still around)
YA2 1-6 (Uncanny Avengers appear) (Kate gone)
CM8 2-6
SCARSPI2 10-11 / VENOM2 26-27 (old Iron Man suit)
Dark Avengers 175-190 (old Iron Man suit)
Avengers Assemble 9-11 (old Iron Man suit)
NM3 50
FF 611 (Doom returns)
F.F. 23
WSOL 1-6 (Doom already back)
W2 314-317
Savage Wolverine #1-8
Indestructible Hulk 1-2 (black & gold Iron Man)
Avengers Assemble Annual 1 (black & gold Iron Man)
NA3 1-3 (black & gold Iron Man suit) (Mr. Fantastic on Earth)
A5 1 (start), A5 2-FB
A+X 1/2
X:L2 1-6
CM8 7-8
A+X 4
INDH 3-5
Venom v2 12.1
SCARSPI2 12
AARENA 1-12 (Christmas)
ASTONX3 57-58 (Christmas)
YA2 7-13 (while arena kids are missing) (Kate returns)
HAWK5 6 & 17 (says December 13-19, but Kate isn’t back until YA2 13)
YA2 14-15 (New Year’s Eve)
FF4 1-3 / F.F.2 1-3 (New Year’s Day) (Mr. Fantastic “in space”) (replacement FF form)
AARENA 13
TB3 1
X:L2 7
A5 (end), 2-5 (Parker is Spider-Man)
AARENA 14-18
WSOL 7-14
INDH 6-8
PWZ3 1-5 (Parker is Spider-Man)
Venom v2 28-30 & 31-FB
ASM 695-700 (Octavius becomes Spider-Man) (Uncanny Avengers appear)
Avenging Spider-Man 15.1
Superior Spider-Man 1-3
DD3 17-22
X-Factor 246-262 (Uncanny Avengers) (replacement FF) (Octavius is Spider-Man)
Red She-Hulk 58-60
AVENGSM 16 (Beast cat-like)
JiM 646 (6-20), 647-651 (Octavius is Spider-Man) (Iron Man -VO)
Thor: God of Thunder 1-11
F.F.2 4-8
AVENGSM 17 (replacement FF appear)
TB3 2-11
SCARSPI2 12.1, 13-15
Avengers Assemble 12-13
TB3 12-13
IM6 1-5 (1-13)
Red She-Hulk 61-67
ASTONX3 59-61 / XXX2 13 / AOA2 14
Thor: God of Thunder 12
A5 6-9 (Octavius is Spider-Man)
X:L2 8
SUPSM 4-6
SCARSPI2 16
AVENGSM 18-19
Alpha: Big Time 1-5
SUPSM 7-10 (Octavius on Avengers probation)
NA3 4-6 (Iron Man on Earth) (Beast cat-like) (Mr. Fantastic “in space”)
SECA2 1-2
AVENGSM 20-21 (SHIELD’s Secret Avengers appear)
DPOOL5 1-6 & 8-12 (Octavius on Avengers probation)
AVENGSM 22 (Punisher appears)
Morbius v2 1-9
Nova v5 6 (16-20), 7 (1-19)
SUPSM 11-13 (Octavius’ old suit destroyed, starts working on new suit)
WSOL 15-19
FF4 4-5
X:L2 9
DD3 23-27 (before AAI 1 for Pym) (black & gold Iron Man)
HAWK5 8-16, 18-22 (Mockingbird just fine) (Hawk & S-W break up)
CM8 9-12 (Iron Man on Earth)
CM8 13-14 / AASS 16-17
INDH 9-10
DD3 28-30
SECA2 3-8 (Mockingbird goes missing) (Hill promoted)
GAM5 1-13
ANX 1-8 (Beast becomes ape-like)
W&X 24
X:L2 10-12
X3 1-3
Venom v2 31-35
SCARSPI2 17-19
A+X 7
SUPSM 14-16 (Octavius gets new suit)
AoU 10 (Beast ape-like, Iron Man on Earth)
INDH 11-15
AoU 10AI
AAI 1-6
UX3 1-2
ANX 9-11 / UX3 3-4 (Iron Man on Earth)
UX3 5-9
IM6 5 (14-20), 6-8 (Iron Man leaves for space)
ANX 11-14 (Iron Man in space) (Hill in charge of SHIELD) (original UA roster)
GOTG3 1-7
IM6 9-16 (1-10)
UX3 10-11
GAM5 14
FF4 6-9
ANX 15
GAM5 15-17
W&X 25-28, 29-FB
UA 5-6 (UA roster expands)
A5 10-13 (Iron Man in space) (Octavius on Avengers probation)
NA3 7 (Beast ape-like) (Mr. Fantastic “in space”)
SUPSMTU 1-2 / SCARSPI2 20-23 (Octavius’ probation lifted)
F.F.2 9
Venom v2 36-37
Superior Carnage 1-5
W&X 29
A+X 12
C&XFOR 1-14 (expanded UA roster)
UXFOR2 1-12
C&XFOR 15-17
CA7 1-11 (days before UA 7-22)
UXFOR2 12-15 (Storm in LA)
UA 7-22 (Octavius w/Avengers) (Storm in LA)
C&XFOR 18-19 / UXFOR2 16-17 (end of Storm in LA)
ASTONX3 62-68
Venom v2 38-39
W&X 30-35
JiM 652-655
A5 14-17
X:L2 13-18
Savage Wolverine #12-13
W5 1-13
Fearless Defenders 1-6
SUPSM 17-19
Venom v2 40-42
ANX Spec / INDH Spec / SUPSM Spec
Fearless Defenders 7-9
FF4 10-16 / F.F.2 10-16 (Mr. Fantastic returns from “in space”)
W6 1-FB
X3 4
IM6 16 (11-20), 17 (Iron Man returns from space)
INDH@ 1 (Iron Man back from space)
ANX 16-17 / X3 5-6 / UX3 12-13 / W&X 36-37 / X:BotA 1-2 (1-28) / ANDOOP 1-5
UX3 18 (4-11)-FB
UX3 14
X:BotA 2 (29-31)
ANX 18 / UX3 18 (12:2-18)-FB
NA3 8 (Iron Man returned “days ago”) (Mr. Fantastic back from “in space”)
INFINITY


Stuff that still needs to get filled in:

A+X #2-3, 5-6, 8-11 (publication dates suggest #13-18 is after INFINITY)
Superior Foes of Spider-Man #1-??? (starts before or after INFINITY?)

Gotta take a break to get caught up on some other stuff. INFINITY to ORIGINAL SIN in a bit!
-Daron Jensen

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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Paul Bourcier » Tue Jun 23, 2015 6:05 am

Superior Foes of Spider-Man is likely after Infinity. The 17-issue series (minus FBs) probably takes a few weeks to unfold; at least part of the series occurs in August and it ends while it's still baseball season, so before the Halloween of Nova v5 #22.

One clue is that a flashback in issue #14, which occurs between issues #11 and 12, shows Reed Richards and Ben Grimm (not in prison) in their red uniforms, indicating a likely placement between Fantastic Four v5 #3-4.

Issue #11 shows Superior Spider-Man (before SuSM 27), and the series' framing sequence (which takes place after the series; probably not long after) shows Peter Parker.
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Jason Doty » Tue Jun 23, 2015 7:27 am

For Cyclops' group in Uncanny, A+X 13-18 (Cyclops/Captain America Story) takes place after UX3 #9, because of Irma Cuckoo dying her hair.

In looking at the other stories in these issues, I believe they all could fit before Infinity. In the Shadowcat/Vision story, they are both abducted, Shadowcat would likely have to be abducted before leaving the Jean Grey School, a known location for her.

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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Jason Doty » Tue Jun 23, 2015 8:35 pm

In Infinity: The Hunt #1, takes place while the missing kids are in Avengers Arena, because Striker assumes they have just left. Hence the various schools holding a field day event, which I doubt they would hold if they knew they were abducted. The foot note says see Avengers Arena.

You have Avengers Arena ending well before Infinity. I'm still going with Infinity happening prior to Battle of the Atom.

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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Col_Fury » Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:21 pm

Luckily, it's a fairly ambiguous reference:

Striker thinks to himself "Pretty slim pickings for us with all the kids who left*"

Editor's note says "*See Avengers Arena!"

Of the kids that were abducted from the Avengers Academy (Reptil, Mettle, Hazmat, X-23 & Juston), none of them came back to the Academy after the Murderworld ordeal. Mettle
Spoiler:
died
, Hazmat "retired," X-23 eventually ended up with the time-displaced X-Men, and I don't recall what happened to Juston and his Sentinel. Reptil showed up at the beach party at the end of Avengers Undercover, so I guess he "retired," too.

All this means is that Avengers Arena already happened, not necessarily that it's going on at the time of Infinity. Arena can't happen around the time of Infinity anyway; Arena starts around the same time the Fantastic Four leave for space. The Fantastic Four have to leave AND return before Infinity starts, and they're gone for longer than the Arena thing lasts.
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Midnighter » Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:31 am

In Infinity: The Hunt there is also a reference to the absence of some british student of the Braddock Academy. And Cap Britain (or Meggan, I can't remember) speaks of absence, not abduction. It seems that the events of Arena are still unknown.

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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Col_Fury » Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:30 am

Meggan says "While we're experiencing some truancy problems* and our ranks are depleted..."

Editor's note says "Another reason to check out Avengers Arena!"

Of course, some of their students died, one turned into a maniac and some never returned to the school. She could have just been phrasing things politely.

Infinity: the Hunt #1 was published the same month as Avengers Arena #15. So yes, the ending for Arena was unknown at the time. :wink:

Good lookin' out, folks! :)
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Jason Doty » Wed Jun 24, 2015 7:36 am

Here's my problem Fury,

How much evidence is enough. Vague evidence beats, none. Are you under some kind of directive to place Infinity where you have it? It's as if your just keeping it where it is at to accommodate the "Inhumanity" tie-ins that happen after, but obviously happen at different points in time. Sometime this weekend, I'll take your list and see what it looks like if we readjust based on some of these vague clues.

As usual, I respect the hard work you do. I just can't agree with this placement on this. I'll keep at it.

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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Jason Doty » Wed Jun 24, 2015 7:19 pm

Fury wrote
All this means is that Avengers Arena already happened, not necessarily that it's going on at the time of Infinity. Arena can't happen around the time of Infinity anyway; Arena starts around the same time the Fantastic Four leave for space. The Fantastic Four have to leave AND return before Infinity starts, and they're gone for longer than the Arena thing lasts.
It sounds as if Arena is happening, Also, why do the Fantastic Four have to be back? I only noticed Mr. Fantastic in Infinity and hasn't he been traveling back and forth in secret to deal with incursions?

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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Col_Fury » Wed Jun 24, 2015 9:12 pm

Because Black Bolt appears with the rest of the Inhumans in FF4 16 ~ F.F.2 16 (where the Fantastic Four return); this has to happen before the Infinity crossover (where Black Bolt blows up his city and lets the rest of the Inhumans think he's dead).
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Jason Doty » Wed Jun 24, 2015 11:01 pm

That's 100 % solid evidence. No argument from me on that front, Thanks.

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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Jason Doty » Sun Jun 28, 2015 7:55 pm

Fury, I figured Deadpool might be the key to placing Infinty.

Thunderbolts v3 #1-6
Thunderbolts v3 #7-11 (Uncanny Avengers appear, with Wolverine)
Thunderbolts v3 #12-13
Thunderbolts v3 #14-18 (Infinity)
Thunderbolts v3 #19
Thunderbolts v3 #20-22
Thunderbolts v3 #23 (Venom quits)
Thunderbolts v3 #24-26
Deadpool v4 #15-19 (Wolverine no healing factor Nightcrawler dead)
Deadpool v4 #21-25
Deadpool: Dracula's Guantlet v4 #1-7
Deadpool v4 #27 (Nightcrawlers Alive)
Deadpool v4 #28 (Honeymoon, Sunfire unchanged)
Thunderbolts v3 #27 (Deadpool Married, Uncanny Avengers appear Sunfire, Wolverine in armor)

The break between Deadpool being married is between Thunderbolts 26-27
So in looking for a break for Deadpool it would appear that Battle of the Atom then Amazing X-Men v2 1-6 would come between Deadpool v4 #15-19 and #27, In fact much of Deadpool might between Thunderbolts #26 and 27 considering Agent Preston is part of his personality and traveling on a sub with the Thunderbolts up until Infinity.

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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Paul Bourcier » Sun Jun 28, 2015 9:43 pm

I only have a few Deadpool comics from this period, so this is helpful.

I think I can add a couple of notes...

Blade mentions the Dracula's Gauntlet adventure in MA2 9, so MA2 6-9 must occur after that mini series. Blade appears in MA2 6-9 before Deadpool #27.

Also, the FB in Death of Wolverine: Deadpool & Captain America #1 (involving Wade and Logan) shortly after Deadpool #19.

...But we're really talking Infinity to Original Sin here, yes?
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Col_Fury » Mon Jun 29, 2015 4:55 am

Jason Doty wrote:it would appear that Battle of the Atom then Amazing X-Men v2 1-6 would come between Deadpool v4 #15-19 and #27
Yes, Amazing X-Men v2 #1-6 (Kurt returns) happens between Deadpool v5 #14-19/21-25 (Kurt dead) & #27-28 (Kurt alive). Also, yes, Battle of the Atom (Kurt dead) happens before Amazing X-Men v2 #1-6 (Kurt returns). I don't see how that alone means Battle of the Atom (Kurt dead) also happens after Deadpool v5 #14-19/21-25 (Kurt dead), though. What am I missing?
Jason Doty wrote:In fact much of Deadpool might between Thunderbolts #26 and 27 considering Agent Preston is part of his personality and traveling on a sub with the Thunderbolts up until Infinity.
Preston got stuck in Deadpool's head back in Deadpool v5 #1-6/8-12. Octavius appears as Spider-Man in his older suit in Deadpool v5 #1-6/8-12. Octavius appears as Spider-Man in his new suit during INFINITY. Thunderbolts v3 #14-18 are INFINITY tie-ins. That means at least Deadpool v5 #1-6/8-12 (where Preston is in his head) have to happen before INFINITY (TB3 14-18), and not after TB3 26.

Also, TB3 12-13 show that at least Punisher leaves Ross' submarine to go do other stuff, so there's no reason to think Deadpool is in the sub exclusively from TB3 2-11 to INFINITY.

Deadpool v5 #14-19/21-25 happens "months" after Deadpool v5 #1-6/8-12. At the moment I'm under the impression these issues are after INFINITY (DPOOL5 21-25 were all published after INFINITY 6), but I'm not entirely convinced of that, and could be persuaded otherwise. In theory, I suppose all of Deadpool v5 #1-25 could happen between TB3 13-14 (before INFINITY); that would mean Preston isn't -BTS in TB3 14-18, which I would prefer, actually. That would mean since Wolverine doesn't have his healing factor in Deadpool v5 #14-19/21-25, he wouldn't have it in INFINITY, either, which is the impression I'm already under.

I've kind of lost track at this point, though. What does any of this have to do with placement of Battle of the Atom in relation to INFINITY? I haven't read TB3 19-26 yet, is Battle of the Atom mentioned there or something? Or Preston?
Paul Bourcier wrote:...But we're really talking Infinity to Original Sin here, yes?
Deadpool v5 #27-28 happens shortly before Original Sin, yes. And it's starting to sound like TB3 27 is after Original Sin.
Paul Bourcier wrote:Blade mentions the Dracula's Gauntlet adventure in MA2 9, so MA2 6-9 must occur after that mini series. Blade appears in MA2 6-9 before Deadpool #27.
Thanks! And yes, this is all after INFINITY and before ORIGINAL SIN.
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Re: AVX to INFINITY

Post by Jason Doty » Mon Jun 29, 2015 8:56 pm

O.K Fury, I'm going to concede that Wolverine looses his feeling factor before Infinity. After going through all of Deadpool 1-25, though I still don't agree that Battle of the Atom takes place before it.

Deadpool v4 #1-6 (Deadpool vs. Dead Presidents/Preston put in Deadpool's head/Cap in old uniform/Iron Man in black and gold armor)

Deadpool v4 #8-12 (Doc Ock as Spidey before changing costume, second time he met Deadpool, or still has Parker's memories/Before Strong Guy takes Hell from Mephisto/Before Daredevil admits he's Matt Murdock and leaves for San Fransisco)

Deadpool v4 #14 (Stand alone with Luke Cage and Iron Fist

Deadpool v4 #15-19 (After Storm and Wolverine hook up, after Wolverine looses healing factor/Cap new costume, after loosing someone close to him)

Deadpool v4 #21-25 (p.1-20) (Sabretooth with Hand Ninja, Deadpool gets rid of Preston heads on vacation to Europe)

I believe Thunderbolts v3 should happen after all of Deadpool v4 #1-25 Do you think this order can stand for Deadpool and the references?

Thunderbolts v3 #1-6 (Deadpool recruited from France/no Agent Preston)

Thunderbolts v3 #7-11 (Uncanny Avengers Captain America new Uniform, Wolverine, Scarlet Witch, Havok)

Thunderbolts v3 #12-13

Thunderbolts v3 #14-18 (Infinity)

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