Flashbacks in Uncanny X-Force #17

[Paul Bourcier]

Can anyone propose where the flashbacks in last week's Uncanny X-Force #17 should go?

1st FB:
Professor X has Angel work with a bazooka because Xavier predicts "difficulty in the coming years." I think the only time Angel was ever seen with a bazooka was on the cover of UX 1, but never in-story. Iceman appears to have his icy form, so this should be after UX 8.

2nd FB:
After the death(?) of Warren Worthington's father (victim of a "terrible crime"), Warren attends the Hellfire Club, where we see Sebastian Shaw and Donald Pierce. There, Warren meets Betsy Braddock for the first time. Warren is aware that Betsy's brother is Captain Britain.

[loki]

Can anyone propose where the flashbacks in last week's Uncanny X-Force #1 should go?

1st FB:
Professor X has Angel work with a bazooka because Xavier predicts "difficulty in the coming years." I think the only time Angel was ever seen with a bazooka was on the cover of UX 1, but never in-story. Iceman appears to have his icy form, so this should be after UX 8.

2nd FB:
After the death(?) of Warren Worthington's father (victim of a "terrible crime"), Warren attends the Hellfire Club, where we see Sebastian Shaw and Donald Pierce. There, Warren meets Betsy Braddock for the first time. Warren is aware that Betsy's brother is Captain Britain.

Can't say exactly for the 2nd one, though his parents were both dead by the time of Champions #1 (it's why he felt okay to ditch his secret identity), but the Captain Britain thing skews the timeline a lot - Brian didn't become Captain Britain until several years (real world) after the Champions run, and unless you insert an unseen story where CB somehow interacts with the X-Men it seems highly unlikely Warren could know CB's secret identity (Brian didn't stop protecting it until the Excalibur er, after the X-Men had met him and Betsy). A lot also depends on what Betsy's profession is stated to be - she wasn't a model until partway through Captain Britain's original run, and didn't get recruited by STRIKE until after her brother went to the USA (she didn't have her powers before then).

If Angel is attending the Club and doesn't know Pierce and Shaw are villains, this has got to be prior to the X-Men's first major Hellfire Club arc. It's a stretch, but perhaps feasible that the X-Men could have learned about Brian's secret identity during his studies in NYC as Peter Parker's roommate, either from an unseen adventure, or because they learned it from Spider-Man (damn those prying telepaths!), and that gives a window of a couple of years (real time).

[JephYork]

Last WEEK'S Uncanny X-Force #1?

-Jeph!

[Jason Doty]

It's no.17

[Michael]

The Hellfire Club flashback is weird. In X 29, Betsy and Warren explain to each other that they're members of the Hellfire Club, which is strange if that's where they met. (I suppose we could write the dialogue in X 29 off as an error- maybe Warren and Betsy have had their minds tampered with too many times over the years.)
Warren's father died in KZ 2/2, which we have placed between UX 48 and 49, long before there was a Captain Britain. Incidentally, we have Captain America's appearances in CB 15-27 placed between A 146 and CA 193, so it is possible that this flashback takes place during Warren's time with the Champions. (The Champions appear in A 151.)
Warren's knowing about Brian being Captain Britain is difficult. The New Mutants learn Brian's identity in NM@ 2. The X-Men find out shortly after this but it's highly unlikely that Warren learned through them since X-Factor had cut off all contact with the X-Men at this point. There's another reason not to place this flashback at this point, though.
In M/GN 4, Pierce betrays Shaw, and at the end of the issue, the New Mutants turn him over to Tessa, who leaves him to the mercy of Shaw. Pierce escapes from Shaw in UX 245, which is after UX 242, when Betsy and Warren were first shown working together. So ideally, this flashback should take place before M/GN 4. (Unless we want to assume that Shaw forgave Pierce, and then Pierce betrayed him AGAIN and then Shaw locked him away again.)
So ideally this flashback should take place sometime between Warren's time in the Champions and M/GN 4. Maybe Peter Parker couldn't keep his mouth shut.

[Michael]

OK, I just realized this flashback makes no sense. Betsy is purple-haired and Brian is also at the Hellfire Club party- that means this has to take place after Daredevils 3, when Brian first learned Betsy dyed her hair. But the Daredevils stories take place after M/GN 4- in Daredevils 9, Jaspers refers to H2 279 as happening "last month". And Pierce is present at this party, i.e. after he should be locked away by Shaw.
Even more bizarrely, Shaw offers to kill the people who murdered Warren's father, which is weird if this takes place long after Warren's father was killed. And Shaw feels the need to tell Warren that they have mutual "friends" (i.e. the X-Men) , which is weird if this takes place long after UX 137- how did Shaw think that the X-Men explained why Jean went nuts to Warren?
Also, Warren somehow knows that Betsy's father was killed by an artificial intelligence that he created- I can't think of any stories prior to Betsy joining the X-Men where Brian or Betsy tell any American heroes how their father died.