Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis (now expanded)

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Frans
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans »

Ok, I've thought everything out a while ago. I don't understand the page numbering, is that including the adds? I know that for instance Thunderbolts #158 intertwines with a lot of other issues than Fear Itself, I believe Herc, Home Front and other villain appearances. I can remember that sometimes characters appear there were it's not possible. Should we not take it down a notch. I've read everything, and have put them in the order as mentioned. We can discuss it one part at a time. The first part until Fear Itself #2 is not that difficult, I think...

1. Avengers #13: Red Hulk eating eggs.
2. New Avengers #14 Mockingbird appears alive at the dinner table in Avengers Mansion.
3. New Avengers #15 Training session with Wolverine, Iron Fist and Squirrel Girl in Mansion's Garden.
4. Fear Itself: Book of the Skull - prologue / Fear Itself: Sin's Past (can happen at the same time)
5. Invincible Iron Man #503 Iron Man asks Thor if he agrees with him rebuilding Asgard. The end of this issue the hammers soar the sky, that part intertwines with end of Fear Itself #1 (but no character overlaps...)
6. Fear Itself #1 Iron Man tells Captain America that Thor agrees. With Avengers in announcement of rebuilding Asgard. Thor quarrel with Odin.
7. Journey into Mystery #622 Thor speaks with Loki about his argument with Odin.
8. Fear Itself #1 Odin knocks Thor down and forces him to leave Earth.
9. Fear Itself Homefront #1 Deals with Avengers Academy capturing minor villains. Speedball at Stamford. Agents of Atlas fight nazi groups. Elderly Broxton dealing with tourists and something happening; Gods leave Earth.
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Jason Doty »

Hey Frans,
The page numbers don't include the adds. Since I had the Fear Itself box out, I started adding in the individual series that begin with "Fear Itself." I was just about to tackle "Home Front."

The ones that are side by side happen at roughly the same time. Certain parts of an issue have to come before a certain event, while others can take place along side. I'm just taking it a series at a time.

If you could make a list of all the regular titles and were you think they should fit. I'll pull them tomorrow and we'll finish up Fear Itself by tomorrow evening evening.
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans »

Excellent. It's good to talk to someone who's also concerned with chronology. And Fear Itself is one of the trickiest I've met, on a number of points it doesn't compete... I'm nearly finished by the way.

For my "personal" Marvel chronology I've taken it all from a character perspective and not from an issue or page perspective. It's hard to treat it another way, because of all the discrepancies. But later we'll discuss about it :D
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans »

Hi Jason, I've checked and re-checked everything. For this order to work, we have to make some assumptions. Please have a look and discuss afterwards? It was a while ago I made my list, so this has taken me hours :roll:

AVENGERS v4 #13 FB (RED HULK eggs eating)
NEW AVENGERS v2 #14 FB (MOCKINGBIRD returning alive)
NEW AVENGERS v2 #15 FB (SQUIRREL GIRL training session)
FEAR ITSELF: BOOK OF THE SKULL v1 #1
FEAR ITSELF: SIN'S PAST v1 #1
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #1/2 (ATLAS)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #2/2 (ATLAS)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #3/2 (ATLAS)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #4/2 (ATLAS)
INVINCIBLE IRON MAN v1 #503 (IRON MAN ASKS THOR REBUILDING ASGARD)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 1-7)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #1/3 (J. JONAH JAMESON)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 8-13)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 14-15)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 16-23)
JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v3 #622
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 24-29)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 30-39)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 40-43)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #4/4 (BLUE MARVEL)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 44)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #1/4 (BROXTON, OKLAHOMA RESIDENTS)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #1 (AVENGERS ACADEMY)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #2 (p.1-5)
THUNDERBOLTS v1 #158 (p.1-9)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #2 (p.6-9)
JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v3 #623
THUNDERBOLTS v1 #158 (p.10-11) (MAN-BULL FREED FROM HOLDING CELL)
HERC v1 #3 (p.1-4/1) (MAN-BULL BREAKS OUT FROM INSIDE)
THUNDERBOLTS v1 #158 (p.12-17)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #2/3 (PURPLE MAN) 
HERC v1 #3 (p.4/2-9) (MAN-BULL A.O. FLEE RYKER'S)
THUNDERBOLTS v1 #158 (p.18-22)
HERC v1 #3 (p.10-22) (MAN-BULL A.O. BANK ROBBERY)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #2 (p.10-11) 
FEAR ITSELF v1 #2 (p.12-14)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #2 (p.15-19)
THUNDERBOLTS v1 #159
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #2 (AVENGERS ACADEMY)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #2/4 (TIGER SHARK)
INVINCIBLE IRON MAN v1 #504 (IRON MAN TO PARIS)
INVINCIBLE IRON MAN v1 #505
FEAR ITSELF: YOUTH IN REVOLT v1 #1 (p.1-16)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #2 (p.20-22)
FEAR ITSELF: DEADPOOL v1 #1
FEAR ITSELF: DEADPOOL v1 #2
FEAR ITSELF: DEADPOOL v1 #3
FEAR ITSELF: SPIDER-MAN v1 #1
FEAR ITSELF: SPIDER-MAN v1 #2 (p.1-16)
SECRET AVENGERS v1 #13
THUNDERBOLTS v1 #160
IRON MAN 2.0 v1 #5
IRON MAN 2.0 v1 #6
IRON MAN 2.0 v1 #7
FEAR ITSELF: UNCANNY X-FORCE v1 #1
FEAR ITSELF: UNCANNY X-FORCE v1 #2
FEAR ITSELF: UNCANNY X-FORCE v1 #3
AVENGERS ACADEMY v1 #15
FEAR ITSELF: THE DEEP v1 #1 (p.1-8)
FEAR ITSELF: WOLVERINE v1 #1
FEAR ITSELF: WOLVERINE v1 #2
FEAR ITSELF: WOLVERINE v1 #3
FEAR ITSELF: FEARSOME FOUR v1 #1
FEAR ITSELF: FEARSOME FOUR v1 #2
FEAR ITSELF: FEARSOME FOUR v1 #3
FEAR ITSELF: FEARSOME FOUR v1 #4
THUNDERBOLTS v1 #161
THUNDERBOLTS v1 #162
FEAR ITSELF: SPIDER-MAN v1 #2 (p.17-23)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #3 (p.1-4)
FEAR ITSELF: YOUTH IN REVOLT v1 #1 (p.17-20)
FEAR ITSELF: YOUTH IN REVOLT v1 #2 (p.1-3)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #3 (p.5-6)
HULK v1 #37 (p.1-11)
AVENGERS v4 #13
FEAR ITSELF v1 #3 (p.7-9)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #3 (p.10-13)
FEAR ITSELF: FF v1 #1
HULK v1 #37 (p.12-22)
AVENGERS v4 #14
HULK v1 #38
FEAR ITSELF v1 #3 (p.14-16)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #3 (p.17-22)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #3/4 (CARDIAC)
AVENGERS v4 #15
FEAR ITSELF v1 7.1 FB (p.6-7)
FEAR ITSELF v1 7.1 FB (p.11-12)
FEAR ITSELF: SPIDER-MAN v1 #3
NEW AVENGERS v2 #14
NEW AVENGERS v2 #16 FB (p.5-14)
NEW AVENGERS v2 #15
NEW AVENGERS v2 #16 (p.16-19)
ALPHA FLIGHT v4 #1
HERC v1 #4
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #3 (AVENGERS ACADEMY)
AVENGERS ACADEMY v1 #16
FEAR ITSELF: YOUTH IN REVOLT v1 #2 (p.4-20)
AVENGERS ACADEMY v1 #17
BLACK PANTHER: THE MAN WITHOUT FEAR v1 #521
HEROES FOR HIRE v3 #9
HEROES FOR HIRE v3 #10
HEROES FOR HIRE v3 #11
GHOST RIDER v5 #1
GHOST RIDER v5 #2
GHOST RIDER v5 #3
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #4 (AVENGERS ACADEMY)
JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v3 #624
ALPHA FLIGHT v4 #2
JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v3 #625
ALPHA FLIGHT v4 #3
BLACK PANTHER: THE MAN WITHOUT FEAR v1 #522
BLACK PANTHER: THE MAN WITHOUT FEAR v1 #523
FEAR ITSELF: YOUTH IN REVOLT v1 #3
GHOST RIDER v5 #4
SECRET AVENGERS v1 #14
FEAR ITSELF: YOUTH IN REVOLT v1 #4
FEAR ITSELF: YOUTH IN REVOLT v1 #5
AVENGERS ACADEMY v1 #18
FEAR ITSELF: YOUTH IN REVOLT v1 #6 (p.1-15)
FEAR ITSELF: THE DEEP v1 #1 (p.9-22)
FEAR ITSELF: THE DEEP v1 #2
FEAR ITSELF: THE DEEP v1 #3
UNCANNY X-MEN v1 #540
AVENGERS v4 #16
AVENGERS v4 #17
FEAR ITSELF v1 #4 (p.1-2)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #3/3 (PEOPLE OF PARIS) 
FEAR ITSELF v1 #4 (p.3-4) 
FEAR ITSELF v1 #4 (p.5-8) 
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #4/3 (ATLANTEANS)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #4 (p.9-14)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #4 (p.15-20) 
FEAR ITSELF v1 #4 (p.21-22) 
FEAR ITSELF v1 7.1 FB (p.13-14)
UNCANNY X-MEN v1 #541 / NEW MUTANTS v3 #29
UNCANNY X-MEN v1 #542 / NEW MUTANTS v3 #30
FEAR ITSELF: THE BLACK WIDOW v1 #1
FEAR ITSELF v1 #5 (p.1-3) 
FEAR ITSELF v1 #5 (p.4-5)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #5 (p.6-22)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #5/3 (MR. FEAR)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #5/4 (AMERICAN EAGLE)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #5 (AVENGERS ACADEMY)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #5/2 (CHOSEN)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #6/2 (CHOSEN)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #7/2 (CHOSEN)
INVINCIBLE IRON MAN v1 #506
HERC v1 #5
HERC v1 #6
AVENGERS ACADEMY v1 #19
INVINCIBLE IRON MAN v1 #507
NEW MUTANTS v3 #31
JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v3 #626
JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v3 #627
ALPHA FLIGHT v4 #4
FEAR ITSELF: HULK VS. DRACULA v1 #1
FEAR ITSELF: HULK VS. DRACULA v1 #2
FEAR ITSELF: THE DEEP v1 #4
UNCANNY X-MEN v1 #543
INVINCIBLE IRON MAN v1 #508
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #6 (AVENGERS ACADEMY)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #6/3 (DUST/ROCKSLIDE)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #6 (p.1-4) 
FEAR ITSELF v1 #6 (p.5-7)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #6 (p.8)
FEAR ITSELF: HULK VS. DRACULA v1 #3
FEAR ITSELF v1 #6 (p.9)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #6 (p.10-11)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #6 (p.12-14)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #6 (p.15-19)
INVINCIBLE IRON MAN v1 #509
FEAR ITSELF v1 #6 (p.20-22)
SECRET AVENGERS v1 #15
FEAR ITSELF v1 7.1 FB (p.15)
FEAR ITSELF: THE MONKEY KING v1 #1
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #6/4 (GREAT LAKES...)
JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v3 #628
NEW MUTANTS v3 #32
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #7 (AVENGERS ACADEMY)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #7/4 (CITIZENS OF, BROXTON OKLAHOMA)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #7 (p.1-30) / JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v3 #629
AVENGERS ACADEMY v1 #20 (p.1-5)
JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v3 #630
FEAR ITSELF v1 7.2 FB (p.1-12) (ODIN PREPARES THOR's DEAD BODY)
FEAR ITSELF v1 7.3 FB (p.5-6,8-9,11-12,17-22/2) (ODIN REVIVES PARIS)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #7 (p.31-33) / FEAR ITSELF v1 7.2 (p.13-22) (THOR's FUNERAL)
AVENGERS ACADEMY v1 #20 (p.6-10/4)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #7 (p.34:1) / FEAR ITSELF v1 7.1 (p.1-5,8-10,16-22) (BUCKY's FUNERAL)
AVENGERS ACADEMY v1 #20 (p.10/5-16)
FEAR ITSELF v1 7.3 (p.1-4,7,10,13-16,22/3-22/4) (IRON MAN VISITS GREY GARGOYLE)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #7 (p.34:2)
AVENGERS ACADEMY v1 #20 (p.17-22)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #7 (p.34:3-34:5)
FEAR ITSELF: YOUTH IN REVOLT v1 #6 (p.16-17)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #7 (p.35-36)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #7 (p.37-38)
FEAR ITSELF: YOUTH IN REVOLT v1 #6 (p.18-20)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #7 (p.39-42)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #7 (p.43-46)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #7 (p.47-50)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #7 (p.51-54)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #7/3 (J. JONAH JAMESON)
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Jason Doty »

I added in Journey Into Mystery, Iron Man, Iron Man 2.0. This morning on the other list.

To start out I'm pretty sure Avengers and New Avengers Tie-ins come at the end of the list before Alpha Flight no.5, but after all the Fear Itself issues that are intertwined because they are a series of interviews about "where where you during..."rather than being told in real time. (Though the Flashbacks contain clues as to where to place other events)

I just looked through Iron Man issues and added them accordingly. I'm pretty sure the whole issue is a f/b, except for the end when the hammers are falling.

Journey Into Mystery starts with 622 (p.1-21:4) (Just a helpful tool, that is page 1-21 panel 4)
Journey Into Mystery 626.1
Journey Into Mystery 622 (p.21:5)
Then the last pages coincide with the part in fear Itself.

I also moved the Speedball.Avengers Academy down the line farther because there is no break in it, just one event after the other, though I have not checked the Avengers Academy tie ins, but I'm pretty sure they happen at roughly the same time. The Same with the FI: Spider-Man, which has to take place after Thing becomes Angrir and beats down the FF, that's when I think there would be major panic.

I'm pretty sure that covers the events in Fear Itself no.1.
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans »

FEAR ITSELF #1

Love what you have done with Journey into Mystery #626.1. Although it's not official a part of Fear Itself, it fits indeed nicely between those panels. I'm not sure if this is the only place for this issue. I'm not that familiar with Asgardian lore. Most of the Home Front stories can be placed in multiple places, because these are just one-off-appearances of characters, so I agree with your placings.

Invincible Iron Man #503 is not placed correctly in your list. Pages 1-16 follow directly on #502, so maybe better to leave these pages out of Fear Itself, these pages have little to do with it. The rest of #503 most definitely does. Thor agrees to Iron Man to let Asgard be rebuilt (pages 17-18), also confirmed to Captain America in Fear Itself #1 (p.14-15) and the falling of the hammers witnessed by Doc Octopus and Iron Man characters. Therefore it's not to be placed after Fear Itself #2. My suggestion:

FEAR ITSELF: BOOK OF THE SKULL v1 #1
FEAR ITSELF: SIN'S PAST v1 #1
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #1/2 (ATLAS)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #2/2 (ATLAS)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #3/2 (ATLAS)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #4/2 (ATLAS)
INVINCIBLE IRON MAN v1 #503 (p. 17-18)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 1-7)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #1/3 (J. JONAH JAMESON)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 8-13)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 14-15)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 16-23)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 24-29)
JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v1 #622 (p.1-21:4)
JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v1 #626.1
JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v1 #622 (p.21:5)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 30-39) / JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v1 #622 (p.22-24)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 40-43) / INVINCIBLE IRON MAN v1 #503 (p. 19-22)
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #4/4 (BLUE MARVEL)
FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 44)

AVENGERS / NEW AVENGERS As for your statements about Avengers and New Avengers; they are indeed all flashbacks with talking heads, but in between you have action and intervention in Fear Itself. If you don't want to place the early, before Fear Itself Flashbacks, as stated by me, like Red Hulk eating eggs, Mockingbird back alive and the training sessions in the garden, I agree. The other FB we have to place, I think.

IRON MAN 2.0 These issues are placed way out. The Avengers (including War Machine) in Secret Avengers #13 are the first ones in Washington after the nazi troops. Prince of Orphans teleports War Machine from Washington to China in Iron Man 2.0 #5. Absorbing Man, still hammerless, with the help of Titania, grabs the Hammer and becomes Greithoth in Iron Man #6. In #7 they fight Iron Fist. So the issues happen before Fear Itself #3, where Bucky gets killed and where Absorbing Man already has his hammer in Dubai.

FEAR ITSELF THE HOME FRONT - SPEEDBALL These issues tie in to all the events like the Raft villains, Juggernaut rampage, Attuma attacking and later Jocasta involvement through the Infinite Mansion (which is replaced by Absorbing Man and Titania?). So we can't place these one after each other later on.

FEAR ITSELF SPIDER-MAN Actually in #3 Thing becomes Angrir, what makes that #1 and #2 happen before Fear Itself #3. I skipped all the reference to hours in this series, by the way, because it made little sense.

ARE WE ON THE SAME PAGE REGARDING FEAR ITSELF #1 ? IF SO, NOW FEAR ITSELF #2 ?
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Jason Doty »

Frans we are in agreement with issue one. I will adjust it to match.
I cant take credit for the Journey Into Mystery placement. The recap page said that is where it goes.
The only title I did not place is the Avengers Academy because the boxes containing most of my "A"s" are a little hard to get to, I'll refer to your judgement on those.

I moved the Iron Man 2.0, because you are correct.

I don't see the need to push anything up on catching the escapies from the raft as far as Home Front goes, they can be apprehended anytime during fear itself, unless it is shown as part of the escape right after the hammer fell, but we'll get to that. Were good on no.1, go ahead and hit off no.2. I just need Speedball to fight Juggernaut and Attuma before no.4 and hence the issues that tie into that one.
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans »

Perfect! :D Now 9 more Fear Itself issues to go... But first coming back to #1. You've changed the page numbering of Fear Itself #1 (p.8-29), but forgot to delete the following three rows.

I will look into Fear Itself #2 tomorrow, in more detail. Not enough time...

What I can say, is you've moved FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #1/4 (BROXTON, OKLAHOMA RESIDENTS), but it was in the right place at first. It should happen after Fear Itself #1 and before #2. The tourists run from the coffee shop to see the Gods leaving Earth, that's happening at the end of #1.
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans »

Ok, Jason, that's fine. But...you have taken out pages 8-13 completely now :shock:
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Jason Doty »

O.K Frans and whoever wants to chime in. I adjusted for Fear Itself no.2 based on Paul's calender and some of my own thoughts. I moved FI: Wolverine up based on Avengers Tower still standing,Wolverine needing a small break at the end of his adventure, but before the attack on DC. Let me know if this looks right, before we tackle no.3.
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans »

Hi Jason, here are my suggestions :D

FEAR ITSELF: WOLVERINE
Actually Avengers Tower fell at the beginning of Fear Itself: Wolverine #3, so the placing should be closer to that part. Since the issues or more or less one continuous story, it's not splittable.

FEAR ITSELF: DEADPOOL
Only #1 should be placed here, because it makes reference to Juggernaut escaping the Raft, that's when Deadpool hears about the hammers; we also have the real Juggernaut barging through a house. After #1 Deadpool and Walrus have travelled already to Cimmaron, New Mexico; possibly they were near New York (hence the Juggernaut appearance). We could place everything forward, but we have to keep in mind the Juggernaut appearance and Deadpool finding out about the Raft and the hammers. Deadpool has another appearance in FI:UXF.

INVINCIBLE IRON MAN
My suggestion for Invincible Iron Man #503, #504 and #505 would be to only place here #504 (p. 3-5). Then Iron Man had to travel to Paris, which takes at least circa 7 hours (but maybe he's faster than an airplane). The remainder of the issue and #504 and #505 can be around Fear Itself #3. The placing of #503 is an error, because we've covered that during Fear Itself #1.

FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #3/3
Because of the move of the Iron Man issues as well as the indication of #3, I suggest to place it near Fear Itself #3. Grey Gargoyle transforms people to stone in Paris during a number of issues. It is placeable over a great length of time.

AVENGERS ACADEMY
AVENGERS ACADEMY v1 #14 (1-4) should be #15 (p. 1-4)

I've got the following intertwinement between JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY, THUNDERBOLTS ETC.
FEAR ITSELF v1 #2 (p. 1) / JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v1 #623 (p. 1:4)
Odin and Asgardians arrive in Asgard
FEAR ITSELF v1 #2 (p. 2-5)
Thor being put in shackles; he vocally disagrees with Odin again
JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v1 #623 (p. 1:5-4)
Odin orders to fabricate weapons for the coming war, he gets Hel-Wolf; Volstagg rescues Loki
THUNDERBOLTS v1 #158 (p. 1-5)
Thunderbolts battle in Iraq
FEAR ITSELF v1 #2 (p. 6-7) / THUNDERBOLTS v1 #158 (p. 6-9) / THUNDERBOLTS v1 #159/4 (p. 1-4) / THUNDERBOLTS v1 #159/3 (p. 1)
Juggernaut and guards, grabbing the hammer after impact; Man-Bull in holding cell; Crossbones in fitness space with other inmates; John Walker in his room before impact
FEAR ITSELF: THE HOME FRONT v1 #2/3 (PURPLE MAN) 
Purple Man in water throught the explosion. Probably gets back to the Ryker's….for Heroes for Hire appearance.
THUNDERBOLTS v1 #158 (p. 10-12)
Ghost gets images through of Juggernaut grabbing hammer and initial blast
HERC v1 #3 (p. 1-2:1) / THUNDERBOLTS v1 #159/4 (p. 5-7)
Man-Bull breaks out from inside with other villains like Whirlwind and Griffin
FEAR ITSELF v1 #2 (p. 8-9)
Juggernaut holding the hammer and strikes again (at the guards)
THUNDERBOLTS v1 #158 (p. 13-15)
Juggernaut leaving Ryker's, villains (Whirlwind, Griffin) on the outside. Aftershock, Ember and Icemaster leave in a plane, while Tiger Shark jumps in river
HERC v1 #3 (p. 2:2-3)
Man-Bull, Griffin and Basilisk leaving Ryker's
THUNDERBOLTS v1 #158 (p. 16-20)
Thunderbolts teleport back to catch escaping villains
JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY v1 #623 (p. 5-20) / THUNDERBOLTS v1 #159/1
Loki works at goats; visits Thor, tames Hel Wolf / Thunderbolts catch escaping villains
AVENGERS ACADEMY v1 #15 (p. 1-4)
Escapees from the Raft catched by Giant-Man and other Academy instructors
THUNDERBOLTS v1 #159/2 / THUNDERBOLTS v1 #159/3 (p. 2-10)
Moonstone with femal inmates underground; Ghost with John Walker to the cells
FEAR ITSELF v1 #2 (p.10:1-p.10:2) / INVINCIBLE IRON MAN v1 #503 (p. 1-2) / FEAR ITSELF: THE WORTHY v1 #1/4 (GREY GARGOYLE)
Hammer in Paris picked up by Grey Gargoyle
FEAR ITSELF v1 #2 (p.10:3-11)
Avengers still together, now Captain America splits them up; FF on Yancy Street without Thing

THUNDERBOLTS v1 #159/4 (p. 8-10) should be placed somewhere after Fear Itself Spider-Man #1.

Let me know your thoughts.
Jason Doty
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Jason Doty »

Alright Frans, I made the corrections based on your thoughts.

Scenes that take place at the same time, but don't seem to jive because of perspective or artist interpretation, don't need panel breaks. it's the same scene. See if my corrections for no.1-2 pass muster for you now and then we can start on no.3. As always, thanks for catching my mistakes.

I moved the Journey Into Mystery to happen right after the Raft stuff, ( it shows, the passage of time without interrupting whats going on) I don't think we need to intertwine them.
Jason Doty
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Jason Doty »

Alright Frans, I've did my update for no.3, I don't agree with Paul about Hawkeye appearing in Hulk no.37 before they travel to fight the green Hulk, I think it's after, plus there is a panel in FI: Spider-Man that shows Ms. Marvel which means all of the Avengers stuff with the green Hulk in South America happens before Thing becomes Angrir.

Let me know your thoughts. Fortunately, There's a nice big gap to place stuff between no.3 and 4. At this time,it looks like the Eastern Seaboard is under attack.
Frans
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans »

Jason Doty wrote:Alright Frans, I made the corrections based on your thoughts.

Scenes that take place at the same time, but don't seem to jive because of perspective or artist interpretation, don't need panel breaks. it's the same scene. See if my corrections for no.1-2 pass muster for you now and then we can start on no.3. As always, thanks for catching my mistakes.

I moved the Journey Into Mystery to happen right after the Raft stuff, ( it shows, the passage of time without interrupting whats going on) I don't think we need to intertwine them.
No, that's fine as for the Journey into Mystery issue.

For my own personal character chronology I've looked at the appearances of Man-Bull, Griffin and Basilisk. And they could easily be split; first in the cell, then inside (but out of the cells), then breaking to outside, then away from the island. If you'd rather put it down as artist interpretation, I'm okay with that. It doesn't matter that much in the end.

As for the INVINCIBLE IRON MAN issues I'm sorry to have to disagree. As I said Iron Man had to travel to Paris; then he had to fight Grey Gargoyle; then he had to fight Grey Gargoyle again with Detroit Steel; then he loses the final fight; then he travels back to the USA; he meets Pepper Potts and leaves again. Then his story conitinues in the pages of Fear Itself #4 at the dead body of Bucky Barnes. All as described can never happen in the final pages of Fear Itself #2, between pages 19 and 20.
At the end of #504 Iron Man passes out, maybe that's a good break. Before that put that at the end of Fear Itself #2 and the rest + #503 somewhere during Fear Itself #3.
D'accord?
Frans
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans »

The whole stuff with the Avengers was and is giving me nightmares from a chronology perspective... :twisted:
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