Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis (now expanded)

Discuss chronologies for characters in the main "Marvel Universe"

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Jason Doty
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Jason Doty » Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:17 am

Alright Frans, Emerald, and Paul. I made the corrections to clear up my mistake and then incorporated Paul's list in up to Amazing Spider-Man 656. See how this looks, then we'll go a little farther down the line with his list.

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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Jason Doty » Mon Oct 01, 2012 6:44 pm

Alright, I added more from Paul's list to our timeline. I didn't agree with his placement about the X-Men Serve and protect arc, because Gambit is not available until he's done with X-23. See how this looks so far.

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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans » Mon Oct 08, 2012 3:20 pm

I've just read THOR THE DEVIANTS SAGA #1-5. My comics are heavily X-Men centric and therefore haven't read that much Thor or Avengers. But with my limited knowledge on this subject I would say that this mini-series takes place somewhere between SENTRY: FALLEN SUN v1 #1 and NEW AVENGERS v2 #1 (p.1-7).

My reasoning would be that Asgard (in Broxton) has fallen, so after Siege. Thor "defends" the ruins alone, no other Asgardians seen or present, therefore presumably before MIGHTY THOR #1. Also before AVENGERS #1 and NEW AVENGERS #1, where Thor is in the ranks of the Avengers again.

Does anyone have another view or can we post it in the place I'm suggesting?

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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Paul Bourcier » Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:59 pm

Any reason we can't place Thor: The Deviants Saga (published Jan-May 2012) more in line with the publication order of Mighty Thor, say, between issues #6 and #7, which were published in Nov & Dec 2011? The absence of Asgardians on panel isn't really a clue for placement.
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Emerald_616 » Thu Nov 01, 2012 8:41 am

I've been trying to place Uncanny X-Force #9, but I honestly have no idea where it fits, and if it fits before Schism or after. Thoughts?

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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans » Mon Nov 05, 2012 4:48 pm

Yes, I have some...

Uncanny X-Force #9 takes place directly after #8. The team is on their way back from the battle with Shadow King and discusses Archangel's killing of a soldier. This is a forebode to the Dark Angel Saga. The Dark Angel Saga takes place after Schism, but I think these issues take place before Schism and Fear Itself. As Magneto and Wolverine are still friendly with each other. Wolverine even goes to lengths to fullfill Magneto's assignment.

Since the Archangel persona has the upper hand more and more, I would place this quite closely to FI and Schism. Maybe both issues after X-Men's First to Last story arc. Or do we have other issues then?

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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Emerald_616 » Wed Nov 07, 2012 3:09 pm

Currently, Uncanny X-Force #8 is placed right after Age of X, which I don't really see a problem with, so I don't see why 9 can't go there as well.


Then, the next X-Force story is Fear Itself: Uncanny X-Force.

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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Jason Doty » Thu Nov 08, 2012 6:41 am

Updated Uncanny X-Force no.9 for you guys. Let me know what you guys have next.

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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans » Sun Nov 25, 2012 12:28 pm

Frans wrote:I've just read Fear Itself The Fearless #6, where there is a flashback to Fear Itself.
In Asgard Odin talks to Valkyrie about her not being Odin's shield maiden much longer. In a sort of crystal ball in Odin's hand an image of a slain Captain America (Barnes) is seen. Valkyrie tells him she will fight alongside Earth's heroes. They talk some more about the Fear. End of scene.

Valkyrie is seen at the end of Fear Itself #3 at the body of Captain America (Barnes). Valkyrie is also seen at the banquet in Fear Itself #1. And in Secret Avengers #14 with American troops. And in flashback at the body of Captain America (Barnes) in Secret Avengers #15. And then again in Fear Itself #7 the end battle.

I think it should be placed between Fear Itself #3 and Secret Avengers #14.

Any thoughts?
Hey Jason, can you post this flashback scene. Nobody objected sofar...

ALPHA FLIGHT v4 #3
FEAR ITSELF: THE FEARLESS v1 #6-FB (p.1-4)
FEAR ITSELF: YOUTH IN REVOLT v1 #2 (p.4-20)

And for the posting of FEAR ITSELF: THE FEARLESS v1 #6 page numbers (p. 5-20) should be added.

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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans » Mon Nov 26, 2012 3:55 pm

Can we also add the following at the start of Fear Itself. We probably missed it the first time around. Set them both between (TITANIA) and (THING).

FEAR ITSELF: THE WORTHY v1 #1/5 (HULK) Hulk sitting in jungle.
FEAR ITSELF: THE WORTHY v1 #1/6 (ATTUMA) Attuma killing Rorak.

Could we also reassess FEAR ITSELF: THE WORTHY v1 #1 (SKADI) to just before FEAR ITSELF v1 #1 (p. 8-13). In the Worthy story Skadi and her nazis are seen walking towards.

The only FI: Worthy story which has no present tie is the one of Absorbing Man, but that aside.

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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans » Thu Dec 06, 2012 4:19 pm

Hey Jason,

After reading some Thunderbolts issues I've noticed that THUNDERBOLTS v1 #163, #164 and #165 don't happen during Fear Itself. Reason is that Luke Cage is on the Raft with Songbird and Mach-V talking about Fear Itself, the hammers, Juggernaut and the escape of the other Thunderbolts.

I'm not sure where to place this yet, because I haven't read Spider-Island yet. But I know for sure it shouldn't be placed at Fear Itself.

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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Paul Bourcier » Fri Dec 07, 2012 7:34 am

I think those issues of Thunderbolts do occur during Fear Itself. In TB 160, Cage has just defeated some Nazi mechs in New York (part of Fear Itself) and the Thunderbolts story continues directly into TB 161-165.
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans » Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:36 pm

Hi Paul, party agreeing with what you're saying TB #158-162 take place during Fear Itself. Also TB #156-157 at the beginning of FI.

I'm definitely believe that TB #163-165 happen after Fear Itself, because of the following reasons:
- Luke Cage is not present in TB #157-158, where the team fights zombies in Iraq and Juggernaut grabs the hammer. Luke Cage is present in NY at that time at the side of the Avengers (he appears in Fear Itself #1 and #2).
- Luke Cage appears the first page of TB #160 fighting nazi mechs in NYC and running around with Spider-Man and the Avengers in Fear Itself: Spider-Man #1. He even instructs the Thunderbolts to follow and apprehend the Juggernaut.
- He fights with the (New) Avengers in New Avengers #14 and #15, when Avengers Tower falls. And with all Avengers in Avengers #17 and Fear Itself #4.
- He continues to be present in Fear Itself #5, #6, #7.
- For his appearances above it's not likely he runs back to the Raft to quietly talk to Songbird and Mach-V about the Thunderbolts disappearance.
- In TB #163 he says: "The Avengers had enough people. I should have stayed back here with you". Inclining he was with the Avengers at the time of Fear Itself and not with the Thunderbolts.
- Mach-V and Songbird snap at him for not being there. "Like the Avengers have dozens of affiliate members". "We're just frustrated, Luke, when you left, it all looked under control".
- Luke even admits he hit Juggernaut right in his fear of never being free, making him an easy target for the hammer.
- Songbird says "Now we've got to figure out where they fell". Meaning where the Thunderbolts are. When Fear Itself was in full range, Luke would not look for the Thunderbolts.
- Maybe not the biggest argument, but TB #162 was the last issue under the banner of Fear Itself.

For all reasons above, but especially for what's said in TB #163 I strongly believe that #163-165 happen after Fear Itself.

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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Paul Bourcier » Sat Dec 08, 2012 5:01 pm

Yup, that makes sense. I was thinking Cage showed up immediately after the tower disappeared because the Avengers had enough people to allow him to take a break from Fear Itself to check in with the Thunderbolts. I figured Cage gave the T-Bolts the mission to find the wayward team members before being called back to finish Fear Itself with the Avengers. (Fear Itself did take a while.)

I suppose a gap could exist between TB 162 and 18=63, during which Fear Itself played itself out and Cage was with the Avengers the whole time, leaving Songbird and Mach-5 to deal with things. Cage may not have even known about the tower's disappearance for days, until after FI reached its end.
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Re: Hashing out X-Men post utopa-pre regenesis

Post by Frans » Mon Dec 31, 2012 8:43 am

Jason Doty wrote:
Frans wrote
Ok I know that it is stated in the Annuals that it takes before Fear Itself, but the same goes for ACC, there it is stated that it happened after Fear Itself. One of the two is incorrect, I presume. Taking into the account the aggressive behavior of Wonder Man towards the Avengers in the Annuals + his disappearance at the end of Avengers Annual. And also his willingness to cooperate with the Avengers in ACC. I would say first ACC and later the Annuals. Best is to place them after Fear Itself, because that then also explains the absence of Thor in ACC.
Thor not being present in an adventure, doesn't mean it can't take place in a certain place, and the Annual have to take place before A:CC if the characters don't know Scarlet Witch is back and because of FF, A:CC happens before Fear Itself.
Just reviving an old dangler about what has to happen first Avengers/New Avengers Annuals or the ACC? In Avengers #31-34 (story arc End Times) there are several references made to Wonder Man attacking the Avengers (as happened in the Annuals). No reference is made to ACC. After this "proof" I'm more assured in my opinion that the order should be first ACC and then the Annuals. So the Annuals happen after Fear Itself. Opinions?

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