Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

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Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

Post by wolframbane » Fri Jul 17, 2009 3:30 am

I have some questions for any Punisher experts. I am trying to gather together any references as to the first usage of the established names of the members of Frank Castle's family. Would anyone be able to add anything to my research, or clarify some information for me.

FRANK'S WIFE
Her full name of "Maria Elizabeth Castle" was shown on her gravestone in Punisher v7 #1 (2004), as well as in Marvel Encyclopedia #5 (2004) and OHOTMU: Marvel Knights (2005). Is anyone aware of the first usage of the names "Maria" and "Elizabeth," as well as "Maria Elizabeth" together? In OHOTMU v2 #10 (1986), Frank's wife was still unnamed, but by OHOTMU: Master Edition #5 (1991), her name was mentioned as Maria, so at least her first name was revealed between 1986-1991. She was also mentioned as "Maria" in Punisher: Return to Big Nothing (1989), What If v2 #10 (1990) and The Punisher Invades the 'Nam: Final Invasion (1994). Was her name ever mentioned any earlier?

I also came across an online reference to her maiden name being Maria Falconio, but I have not been able to find any other source to back it up. Would anyone be able to site a source, or is this fanfic?

FRANK'S DAUGHTER
Her full name of "Lisa Barbara Castle" (often called by her middle name) was mentioned in Marvel Encyclopedia #5 (2004) and OHOTMU: Marvel Knights (2005). Her gravestone in Punisher v7 #1 (2004) named her "Lisa Castle." Is anyone aware of the first usage of the names "Lisa" and "Barbara," as well as "Lisa Barbara" together? The name "Barbara" was also used in Punisher: Intruder (1989). In OHOTMU v2 #10 (1986), Frank's daughter was still unnamed, but by OHOTMU: Master Edition #5 (1991), her name was mentioned as Lisa Castle, so at least her first name was revealed between 1986-1991.

Her name is (apparently) erroneously given as "Christie" on occassion. According to The Punisher Anniversary Magazine (1993), her name is listed as Christie on page 42. She is also called "Christie" in The Punisher Invades the 'Nam: Final Invasion (1994). Are there any earlier references to her as Christie?

FRANK'S SON
His full name of "Frank David Castle" (sometimes called Frank Jr.) was shown on his gravestone in Punisher v7 #1 (2004), as well as in Marvel Encyclopedia #5 (2004) and OHOTMU: Marvel Knights (2005). Is anyone aware of the first usage of the names "Frank" and "David," as well as "Frank David" together? He was called "Little Frankie" in The Punisher Invades the 'Nam: Final Invasion (1994). When was he called "Frank Jr." specifically? In OHOTMU: Master Edition #5 (1991), Frank's son was still unnamed, so his first name was revealed sometime after 1991.

And for anyone else interested, Punisher's full name is Francis G. "Frank" Castle (formerly Castiglione). "Frank Castle" and "Castiglione" are from Punisher v1 #1 (1986), his full first name of "Francis" is from Official Index to the Marvel Universe #3 (2009), and his middle iitial of "G." is from his dogtag in The 'Nam #69 (1992).

His parents are Mario Lorenzo "Renzo" Castiglione and Louisa Castiglione. "Mario and Louisa Castiglione" are from Punisher v1 #1 (1986), "Lorenzo" and "Renzo" are from Punisher War Journal #25 (1990), and his father's full name of "Mario Lorenzo Castiglione" is from OHOTMU: Marvel Knights (2005). His parents changed their surname to Castle when Frank was six, according to Punisher v1 #1 (1986).

Frank's extended family include his paternal uncles Fredo and Rocco Castiglione, a paternal aunt and grandparents, all from Punisher War Journal #25 (1990), with the aunt being mentioned and seen in a photograph, and the grandparents in the photo as well. Another family member's gravestone was seen in the issue, with the name "Artu-- Castiglione" depicted. Frank also had a sister-in-law, mentioned in Punisher v2 #100 (1995) and possibly a brother-in-law named Jake, shown in What If v2 #10 (1990). His mother also was pregnant with a second son to be named Michael, but miscarried, according to Punisher: The Tyger (2006).

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Re: Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

Post by JLH » Sun Aug 02, 2009 5:42 am

Perhaps I will dig through my collection this week, searching for this information you seek (that rhymed unintentionally). I think I need to do some rebagging, anyway!

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Re: Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

Post by wolframbane » Sun Aug 02, 2009 2:30 pm

JLH wrote:Perhaps I will dig through my collection this week, searching for this information you seek (that rhymed unintentionally). I think I need to do some rebagging, anyway!
Thank you JL. I appreciate it!! :)

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Re: Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

Post by JLH » Fri Aug 07, 2009 12:42 pm

Just got started, and from what I've seen, the names "Maria" for the wife, "Barbara" (also called "Barb") for the daughter, and "Frankie" for the son are established for the first time in Punisher volume 2 #11 (cover dated Sept 1988). I'll keep looking for the other details as I go along.

One side note, is how mixed up the circumstances got concerning what caused the Castle family to get killed. Initially, and most prominently, they witness a hit. But other times, Frank refers to them being caught in the crossfire between two rival mobs!

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Re: Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

Post by JLH » Fri Aug 07, 2009 2:45 pm

His daughter is called "Lisa" for the first time in Strange Tales vol 2 #14. It's repeated in Power Pack #46 (both written by Terry Austin, so it may've been his idea).

More to come!

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Re: Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

Post by JLH » Sat Aug 08, 2009 8:19 pm

Maria gets name dropped a lot over the years (so much that anyone who got her name wrong wasn't doing adequate research). As for the kids, they're called "Barb" and "Frankie Jr" in Punisher POV #2. Continuing...

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Re: Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

Post by JLH » Mon Aug 10, 2009 7:51 pm

Got a couple more. "Frankie Jr" and "Barbie" in Punisher: Ghosts of Innocents #1. "Franky" in Cap/Punisher #3. For most of the time, it's always "Maria and the kids". In fact, I can't recall Chuck Dixon ever calling them by name!

The Punisher Ashcan (dated 1994, circa the end of Suicide Run judging by the art used) has them as Maria, Frank Jr and Christie.

Found a third mob reason given for the family's killing: they witnesses a drug buy! Those were some busy, busy mafioso (err, Maggioso?).

And interestingly enough, the Castle family grave has only been shown about 4 times so far (and no names visible except for Maria's).

Pressing on...

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Re: Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

Post by Enda80 » Tue Aug 11, 2009 6:58 pm

JLH wrote:
Found a third mob reason given for the family's killing: they witnesses a drug buy! Those were some busy, busy mafioso (err, Maggioso?).
They should have chosen a more discrete place than Central Park.

Actually, back then, the cliche of Vietnam veterans losing loved ones to mobsters stood as extremely prevalent from 1969 on; the Executioner, the Sharpshooter, the Assasin, the Avenger, the Revenger, the Penetrator, the Marksman, etc.

http://www.amazon.com/Serial-Vigilantes ... 0786441658

http://thelatarniaforums.yuku.com/searc ... arch+Forum
http://thelatarniaforums.yuku.com/topic/4734
http://thelatarniaforums.yuku.com/reply ... eply-68676

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Re: Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

Post by Somebody » Tue Aug 11, 2009 7:02 pm

Enda80 wrote:They should have chosen a more discrete place than Central Park.
A more separate, or individual place than Central Park, Enda? :-P

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Re: Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

Post by JLH » Tue Aug 11, 2009 8:04 pm

It's Maria, Frank Jr, and Christie in Punisher vol 3 #17 (the underrated Ostrander "no 'the'" run). I have no idea where Christie came from, this is the first time in a regular Punisher comic I've come across it. I even did some checking of the Guts & Gunpowder card set! No names there at all for them. I also checked that "Suicide Run" promotional 'final entry' insert from Nov-Dec 93 comics, the kids again get short-changed names. I'll keep looking for more name variations.

Speaking of which, I think I found a source for the name of Maria Falconio: DeFalco's "Spider-Man: The Ultimate Guide" from 2001. But where did they get it?

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Re: Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

Post by JLH » Wed Aug 12, 2009 3:40 pm

Punisher vol 4 (aka the first Marvel Knights run) #1 has the family as Maria, Frank Jr, and Christie. I still can't figure out where the name "Christie" came from. I've searched from the RPGs to the card sets, nada. The anniversary mag and In the Nam Final Invasion look to be the source, but which one came up with it first, I guess we'll never know. Still looking for the source of the middle names is, if not the issue you mention.

Oh, and on a similar note, found the first true mention of Frank's birth name being "Francis Castiglione": Marvel Knights vol 1 #4 from 2000. It comes from a SHIELD file, so it's as legit as they come (I've seen a character or two call Frank "Francis" generically, even a joke Marvel Universe series 1 card had him correcting Spidey about his name, but this is the first official, solid proof that's what it's short for.)

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Re: Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

Post by wolframbane » Thu Aug 13, 2009 1:21 am

Thank you very much for your help with this JLH. As always your research is greatly appreciated!! You found so many data points that I have not come across.

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Re: Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

Post by JLH » Fri Aug 14, 2009 1:59 pm

I've finally reached the MAX era, and it looks as though volume 7 #1 was the source for Maria and Frank Jr's middle names. Of course, then Ennis went and got Microchip's name (among other things related to him) wrong, so make with that usage what you will. I do think the MCP should change the daughter's name to Lisa Barbara "Christie" Castle, or something close, instead of just Christie, since of all her names, that's the one with the least amount of usage going for it. Barb's the original name given, Lisa's the one used most often.

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Re: Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

Post by JephYork » Fri Aug 14, 2009 2:35 pm

Plus, I think Punisher MAX was recently and retroactively declared non-canon.

-Jeph!

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Re: Punisher's family's names - where were they revealed?

Post by wolframbane » Fri Aug 14, 2009 11:24 pm

To my knowledge, the Max series was disavowed as Earth-616 canon in a recent letters section of the series, but the recent OHOTMU Hardcovers for both Microchip and Punisher still count the Max events in their histories.

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