WAR of the REALMS to EMPYRE

[StrayLamb]

ASM: Daily Bugle 1-2 (if they're canon), some Empyre: X-Men flashbacks, ASM 44, and Free Comic Book Day 2020 (Spider-Man/Venom) 1 all appear to take place just prior to Empyre. ASM5 41/2 appears to take place between ASM5 45 & 46, after Empyre.

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Amazing Spider-Man 41/2
Amazing Spider-Man 41-43
Amazing Spider-Man 43/2
Amazing Spider-Man 44 [Spidey's podcast with Jonah in ASM 39-40 was "a few days ago"]
Amazing Spider-Man: Daily Bugle 2 (1 - 4)
Amazing Spider-Man: Daily Bugle 1
Amazing Spider-Man: Daily Bugle 2 (5 - 20)
Empyre: X-Men 1 (4 - 5)-FB [Early March]
Empyre: X-Men 4 (1 - 10)-FB
Free Comic Book Day 2020 (Spider-Man/Venom) 1 [Spider-Man & Black Cat]
Atlantis Attacks 5 (18 - 19) [One Month Later; early-mid March]
Ruins of Ravencroft: Dracula 1
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Edited into my list on page 12.

There's also a flashback for Carlie Cooper and MJ Watson in ASM5 44 (4:1 - 4:3) that takes place before MJ leaves for LA in ASM5 29.

[StrayLamb]

FF6 24 strongly suggests that X/FF2 takes place between Empyre and that issue; Franklin is now spending a bunch of time hanging out on Krakoa! (And the FF don't appear to have changed their costumes yet.)

Fun fact: besides Ben's right arm (and thus his cast, if he were wearing it) not appearing in the first three issues of X/FF2 at all, nowhere in the miniseries do we see Kate Pryde's knuckles...

I'm pretty sure that X-Men/Fantastic Four 1-4 takes place prior to Empyre. Ben Grimm's arm isn't in a cast, but Kitty Pryde and the Marauders look like they have to appear prior to Marauders 5-12, which seems to be before Empyre. Kitty's in her early Marauders look. We don't see her knuckles in X/FF2, but she changes her entire look in Marauders 12. Also, there's no sign or even mention of Jo-Venn and N'Kalla, and there's really nothing i could see in FF6 24 that precludes this from having happened prior to Empyre. This also has to take place prior to Dr Doom 1-5 for Victor and Victorious.

I think it's easier to explain Ben's arm not being in a cast, than to explain Kitty's reversion to an earlier look. We haven't really seen Ben since Annihilation: Scourge, and perhaps his arm has healed enough at this point for him to leave the cast off from time to time.

The publication dates for X/FF2 1-4 are April to Sept 2020, the same range as Marauders 7-11, FF 19-21, & Dr Doom 5-10, and prior to Empyre.

I would suggest that X/FF 2 1, 2-FB, 2, 3, & 4 (1 - 15) be placed immediately prior to Marauders 5, and the three weeks later X/FF2 4 (16 - 20) be placed before Ruins of Ravencroft: Dracula..

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Wolverine 3 (1 - 16)
X-Men/Fantastic Four 1
X-Men/Fantastic Four 2 (4)-FB
X-Men/Fantastic Four 2
X-Men/Fantastic Four 3
X-Men/Fantastic Four 4 (1 - 15)
Marauders 5-8 [At least two weeks after Marauders 4, probably at least two weeks after Wolverine 1-3]
Cable 2 [Cable dating Cuckoos, after MRDRS 6]
Marauders 9-12 [Cable already dating Cuckoos; before IM2020]
Thor 1 (18 - 30)
---
Atlantis Attacks 5 (18 - 19) [One Month Later; early-mid March]
X-Men/Fantastic Four 4 (16 - 20) [Three weeks later]
Ruins of Ravencroft: Dracula 1
---

FF: Grimm Noir also has Wong at the Sanctum. Wong tells Ben he’s lucky to catch him there, as he’s not at the Sanctum much anymore, and just dropped by to do some research, so this is something that Wong's been doing occasionally. This allows us to place DP@4 after DS4 20. Since the babysitter in Connecticut is wearing shorts, the summer setting we currently have for this issue seems correct.

FF: Grimm Noir 1 (1 - 29) takes place on a day when a chilly rain is falling. Ben's not wearing a sling. FF: Grimm Noir 1 (30) is some time later, on a sunny day, so the whole thing(!) may take place during the autumn?

I had previously placed FF: Grimm Noir after Web of Black Widow 5, but upon reflection, i believe this should be placed prior to FF 12, and probably immediatley after FF: Negative Zone..

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CNTGN 1-5 (Punisher appears) (X-Men being weirdoes) (Thing not wearing cast)
FF:NEGZ 1 (Thing not wearing cast)
FF: GRIMM NOIR 1 (Thing not wearing cast)
ABSOLUTE CARNAGE (Rick in bathtub) (Misty released) (Cap not in prison or hiding)
G-S 4-5
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[Pocokk]

Hello, wish you all Happy New Year!

I have a question if you don't mind: do you plan to include the missing Iron Man 2020 crossover event issues into the masterlist? Titles like 2020 Rescue, 2020 Iron Age, 2020 iWolverine, 2020 Force Works and such. Thank you!

[Clive_Reston]

Worth noting that Sabretooth (2022) #1 begins with Victor Creed's sentencing in House of X #6, and then spans a great deal of time (as it points out, time passes very weirdly in the PIt). Oya appears at the end of the issue after her appearance in X5 8, but before the pre-X of Swords arc of Excalibur. (So her sentencing, as seen in Sabretooth #2's FB, is shortly before Empyre.)

[Clive_Reston]

A few more X-related notes (after a lengthy discussion with the mastermind behind wayofx.wordpress.com ...)

Most of Marauders 3 is a -FB to between issues 1 and 2 (which is why Pyro's face isn't tattooed, for instance).

In Juggernaut 1-5, the Hulk appears between Immortal Hulk 27 and 28, so I think that mini can go there.

I know I suggested having the five Giant-Size specials together, but it sure looks like the framing sequence of Giant-Size X-Men: Magneto is very shortly before Marauders 17--probably just a day or so.

We've currently got the flashback in Wolverine 1 after the rest of the issue!

Nexus War: Thor is gonna be a significant problem if we assume that all the characters were zapped away at the same time (from the final pages of Wolverine 5, X-Factor 3 and Guardians of the Galaxy 7). Perhaps we can assume that since they were returned instants after they left, they were zapped in from... slightly different times?

I suspect that if we want a break-point in the first five issues of Wolverine, after the second page of #4 is probably better than before the last few pages of #3 (the Quiet Council seems to be responding to what's just happened at the end of #3).

[StrayLamb]

There are some flashbacks in INFERNO2 3 that belong in here..

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FLSS 1-4 backups
POX 4 (7-14)-FB
INFERNO2 3 (4-5)-FB [(1-3)-FB is the same as POX 4 (7-14)-FB, and (4-5) follows on immediatley after]
???CA8 7 (17-21), 8 (Cap goes to prison) (Piledriver in prison)
ASM5 25/2 (space suit Dr. Strange)
---
GSXSTATIX 1
INFERNO2 3 (6)-FB [A month later. First resurrection. Should really go just before HOX 5 (1-4)-FB, but it's before INFERNO2 3 (7), which is before HOX 1 (3:1)-FB. HOX 5 (1-4)-FB is just when Magneto brings Polaris in on the resurrections]
HOX 1 (3:1)-FB [mid-July, "five months ago"] [July 20?]
P@5 1
---
MG&DDINO 45 [during a school semester]
INFERNO2 3 (7)-FB [The following month. Krakoa produces the first Gateway Flower, which Doug shows to Magneto. Has to go before HOX 4:1.]
HOX 1 (3:2)-FB [mid-August, "four months ago"] [August 20?]
FNSM2 11
---


The timeline gets completely screwy here. The next flashback is supposedly four months ago, but this all still has to be prior to War of the Realms. From this point on, some artificial time-compression is employed, since between "now" and "four months ago" we've had Empire, King in Black/Hellfire Gala, and Death of Dr Strange, to name a few. I'm continuing the flashback placements as though it's the following month..

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V4 21, WOV:GSON 1, V4 22-???
HOX 1 (3:3)-FB [mid-September, "three months ago"] [September 20?]
INFERNO2 3 (8)-FB [Supposedly four months ago, but actually the following month. Beast and Cypher conducted experiments leading to the creation of the Krakoan wonder-drugs. Has to go before HOX 4:1, where Beast is tending the wonder drug flowers in the Savage Land]
FUFO 1-5
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DD6 6-7 ["8 weeks" since DD6 5]
HOX 1 (4:1)-FB [mid-November, "one month ago"] [November 20?]
INFERNO2 3 (9)-FB [Two months later. Krakoa produces a new flower that creates a no-place outside of its conciousness. This is where Moira is housed]
WPLUS:WWIV 1 (both stories)
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[Clive_Reston]

I am 100% certain that Inferno 3's "four months ago" and "two months ago" are typos for "four months later" and "two months later." For one thing, at least three months pass between the bulk of X5 5 and X5 19, according to the flash-forward at the end of X5 5. Hickman and Duggan's timeline is otherwise very consistent within itself.

[StrayLamb]

I am 100% certain that Inferno 3's "four months ago" and "two months ago" are typos for "four months later" and "two months later."

Makes sense, but INFERNO2 3 (8)-FB still has to go before HOX 4:1, right? The plants in the Savage Land are the ones cultivated for the healing drugs.

I've just based it all on the original HOX/POX chronology.

[Clive_Reston]

Right. My reading of the timeline:

INFERNO2 3 (6) -FB "One month" after Doug brokers the arrangement between Krakoa and Warlock, the Cuckoos are resurrected.

INFERNO2 3 (7) -FB "A month after that," Doug shows Magneto and Xavier the habitat and gateway flowers.

HoX 1 (3:1) -FB "Five months" before Xavier's announcement, Colossus is picking a habitat flower.
HoX 1 (3:2) -FB "Four months" before Xavier's announcement, Storm has brought a habitat flower to the Westchester mansion.
HoX 1 (3:3) -FB "Three months" before Xavier's announcement, Nightcrawler plants a habitat flower on the moon.

INFERNO2 3 (8) -FB Four months *after* INFERNO2 3 (7) -FB, Doug shows Beast the mutant drug flowers. Around the same time...
HoX 1 (3:4) -FB "Two months" before Xavier's announcement, Armor plants a habitat flower on Mars.

HoX 1 (4:1) -FB "One month" before Xavier's announcement, Beast is looking at the growth of a Human Drug L flower. (and then the next couple of panels over the next couple of weeks)

INFERNO2 3 (9) -FB Two months *after* INFERNO2 3 (8) -FB, Doug chats with Krakoa and Warlock about the newly developed No-Place flower, as Xavier is about to announce them to the world.

[StrayLamb]

Okay, so that means INFERNO2 3 (6-7) needs to be pushed back, and INFERNO2 3 (8-9) needs to be pushed forward. Given the timeline that's already been established for War of the Realms to Empyre, that would place INFERNO2 3 (6) in mid-May and INFERNO3 (7) in mid-June. We have War of the Realms taking place in early July, so these two flashbacks will go in Secret Empire to War of the Realms.

SECRET EMPIRE TO WAR OF THE REALMS
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WH 8-12 (after IWARS, before T5 9)
IMMH 9 (1,3)-FB [Mid-May]
POX 4 (7-14)-FB
INFERNO2 3 (4-5)-FB [(1-3)-FB is the same as POX 4 (7-14)-FB, and (4-5) follows on immediatley after. Mid-May]
DS5 10/2, 10-FB, 9-11
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TSIM 6-11 (after IMMH 8) ["two weeks" before TSIM 14]
A7 18 (11,13,15)-FB
WOTR:JIM 1 (3)-FB ["4 weeks" before WOTR]
INFERNO2 3 (6)-FB [A month later. Mid-June]
FF5 5 (1 - 42), FFWED2, FF5 5 (43 - 60), 6-9 ["9 days" before WOTR]
---

WAR OF THE REALMS TO EMPYRE
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GSXSTATIX 1
INFERNO2 3 (7)-FB [The following month. Krakoa produces the first Gateway Flower]
HOX 1 (3:1)-FB [mid-July, "five months ago"] [July 20?]
P@5 1
---
SVERSE3 1-6
HOX 1 (3:4)-FB [mid-October, "two months ago"] [October 20?]
INFERNO2 3 (8)-FB [Four months *later*. Beast and Cypher conducted experiments leading to the creation of the Krakoan wonder-drugs. Has to go before HOX 4:1, where Beast is tending the wonder drug flowers in the Savage Land]
USQG2 47-50 (Tony as Iron Man)
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MIMOSM 14-15 [end of school semester?]
INFERNO2 3 (9)-FB [Two months later. Krakoa produces a new flower that creates a no-place outside of its conciousness. This is where Moira is housed]
HOX 1-6 / POX 1-6 (Krakoa revealed) ~ X5 6 [mid-December, "now"] [December 20-23?]
IMMH 25-26 (Cho, Namor, Tony as Iron Man appear, Krakoa mentioned)
---

How does that look?

[StrayLamb]

Fantastic Four: Road Trip goes in here, between FF6 20 & FF6 21, since they've already been to Spyre, but Ben and Alicia don't yet have the kids. I've placed in Mid-October, which is supposed to be a nice time to visit the Grand Canyon.

Recent updates applied to my list.

[Col_Fury]

Mid-October, which is supposed to be a nice time to visit the Grand Canyon.

I can verify!

[Siabod]

@StrayLamb

In your revised list you seem to have Back Annual twice
Once as "BCAT@ 1" near the very start and again later as "Black Cat 2019 Annual 1 [January]"

You have noted that it shuld be moved


"ASM5 38 says that BCAT@ 1 was "last month." As Midnighter points out, BCAT@ 1 should take place before BCAT3 12. I have it placed between BCAT3 10 & 11, much later than it's current position. It also says to be continued in Black Cat #11. I know Col_Fury has mentioned the "live feeds" before in connection to this issue, but i thought i'd mention that the feeds Chance initially shows to Foreigner may well have been file footage for demonstration purposes, before he shows the actual live feed of Spidey.

Also, the date shown in BCAT@ 1 of Nov 13 2019 is the date the issue was released, and should have no bearing on the issue's placement.

I really enjoyed this story.

Midnighter has also pointed out that all of BCAT3 6-12 & Annual 1 should be placed before Incoming, X-Men 4 and Marauders 4, a position that i agree with, and i've edited that placement into my list above. This also means that DP8 1-4 needs to be moved up as well."


, but I think you've left it in???

Please let me know if I'v got the wrong end of the stick?

[StrayLamb]

@StrayLamb

In your revised list you seem to have Back Annual twice
Once as "BCAT@ 1" near the very start and again later as "Black Cat 2019 Annual 1 [January]"

You are correct! I've placed a strike thru the first BCAT@ 1 listing.

[Spurs91]

THOR v6 #1-??? still needs finalising.
Only noticed since I've just read Marvel Voices Iceman Infinity Comic 1-4, which has a note about being after Thor 1-6.
Also, found out that Iceman series exists while looking through the rolling X-titles thread, but I never came across it in any of the chronologies here.