Chronology: Marvel Super-Heroes Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Discuss chronologies for characters in the main "Marvel Universe"

Moderators: Col_Fury, michel, Arthur, Somebody, StrayLamb

Leoparis
Chronology Guru
Chronology Guru
Posts: 1443
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2007 6:32 am
Location: Paris
Contact:

Re: Chronology: Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Post by Leoparis »

Hulk 313 appears twice. Was it meant to be split in two or is the first one a typo for 312?
User avatar
StrayLamb
Director
Director
Posts: 2303
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:42 am
Location: a sheep paddock, along the Great Eastern Highway

Re: Chronology: Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Post by StrayLamb »

Thanks for pointing that out, Leoparis. I think this fixes it.

Secret Wars II 4 (1 - 14:1)
Avengers 261 (1 - 11:2)
Secret Wars II 4 (14:2 - 17:4)
Incredible Hulk 309-312
Hulk vs Hercules: When Titans Collide 1-FB
Alpha Flight 26-27
Alpha Flight 28 (1 - 15:3)
Incredible Hulk 313 (1 - 13)
Alpha Flight 28 (15:4 - 20)
Incredible Hulk 313 (14 - 21)
Alpha Flight 28 (22)
Incredible Hulk 313 (22)
Alpha Flight 28 (29)
Secret Wars II 4 (17:5 - 26)
Dazzler 40
Doctor Strange 71-74
Vision & Scarlet Witch 3-4

Edited into the main list. It also showed up a discrepancy between the placement of Hulk vs Hercules: When Titans Collide 1-FB for the Hulk and Hercules via the Beyonder, which michel has already addressed over here.. http://www.chronologyproject.com/phpbb2 ... 339#p58339
Out in the Land Down-Under, beneath a rocky outcrop, deep within the back paddock, dwells the Stray Lamb.
User avatar
StrayLamb
Director
Director
Posts: 2303
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:42 am
Location: a sheep paddock, along the Great Eastern Highway

Re: Chronology: Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Post by StrayLamb »

The main list has been updated with better placements for New Defenders, as well as including the missing issues, and a number of Spider-Man issues. Also, a number of issues towards the end have been moved to streamline the period from Halloween to New Year's. Thanks to Frank for pointing out the missing New Defenders issues and the help with fixing up the Christmas issues.
Out in the Land Down-Under, beneath a rocky outcrop, deep within the back paddock, dwells the Stray Lamb.
User avatar
StrayLamb
Director
Director
Posts: 2303
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:42 am
Location: a sheep paddock, along the Great Eastern Highway

Re: Chronology: Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Post by StrayLamb »

With a lot of help from Frank ( :thumbsup: ), the main list has been extensively revised for Rom, along with the entire Casket of Ancient Winters, and thru the Wraith War to Thanksgiving.
Out in the Land Down-Under, beneath a rocky outcrop, deep within the back paddock, dwells the Stray Lamb.
Pocokk
Henchman
Henchman
Posts: 45
Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2018 10:38 am

Re: Chronology: Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Post by Pocokk »

Hey there again! I want to apologize for all these bumps on a (almost) daily basis, but I'm discovering these stuff as I move forward in the list.

Peter Parker, the Spectacular Spider-Man 113 seems to be absent, also according to Spidey's chronology, ASM 276 page 22 should happen after PPSSM 113... or not really? (you revisited this era, so I'm just thinking out loud here)

Also about Amazing Spider-Man Annual 43, you said you needed to reread that part to determine its "proper" placement in the whole chronology, but I don't see you moved it away from its original place, is it a final decision? (because I (still) think the last 2 pages should be closer to ASM 258 due to the removal of the symbiote and putting it to cage as it happened in that ASM issue)

Not to mention Symbiote Spider-Man: Alien Reality just ended today, but turns out the whole thing is happening in an alternate universe/reality, so can't really say its 616 canon et al.

But what about the original Symbiote Spider-Man, can it be still placed after ASM@ 43? Or prior? (as you remember I was trying to determine its placement 7 months ago, didn't really advance since then)
User avatar
StrayLamb
Director
Director
Posts: 2303
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:42 am
Location: a sheep paddock, along the Great Eastern Highway

Re: Chronology: Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Post by StrayLamb »

Pocokk wrote: Wed Jul 29, 2020 11:06 am Hey there again! I want to apologize for all these bumps on a (almost) daily basis, but I'm discovering these stuff as I move forward in the list.
Don't apologize - keep 'em coming!
Pocokk wrote: Wed Jul 29, 2020 11:06 amPeter Parker, the Spectacular Spider-Man 113 seems to be absent, also according to Spidey's chronology, ASM 276 page 22 should happen after PPSSM 113... or not really? (you revisited this era, so I'm just thinking out loud here)
Fixed, thanks!
Pocokk wrote: Wed Jul 29, 2020 11:06 amAlso about Amazing Spider-Man Annual 43, you said you needed to reread that part to determine its "proper" placement in the whole chronology, but I don't see you moved it away from its original place, is it a final decision? (because I (still) think the last 2 pages should be closer to ASM 258 due to the removal of the symbiote and putting it to cage as it happened in that ASM issue)

Not to mention Symbiote Spider-Man: Alien Reality just ended today, but turns out the whole thing is happening in an alternate universe/reality, so can't really say its 616 canon et al.

But what about the original Symbiote Spider-Man, can it be still placed after ASM@ 43? Or prior? (as you remember I was trying to determine its placement 7 months ago, didn't really advance since then)
and... seven months later i still haven't read those. There are only so many hours a day i can put into this! :willynilly:

I've moved SMF2 1, Symbiote Spider-Man 1-5 & Annual 43 down to just before ASM 256 as per your advice. :thumbsup:

If you want to narrow these issues down even more and give me page breakdowns if they're needed, go right ahead. I'm not proprietary about these lists. If you want to correct a section, go for it. I'll take all the help i can get on these projects. :)
Out in the Land Down-Under, beneath a rocky outcrop, deep within the back paddock, dwells the Stray Lamb.
Frank
Big Bad
Big Bad
Posts: 150
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2018 3:32 am

Re: Chronology: Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Post by Frank »

I take this opportunity to linger on the chronology of Rom 52 until Rom 59 and once again try to logically place these episodes in the continuity of the other series of the time while taking into account the chronology of the characters in the MCP .
The public awareness of the presence of the Wraiths on earth because their attacks, the support of the army and the knowledge of all that situation by the President of the US of that time Ronald reagan occurs between episodes of Rom 51 to Rom 53 , The Avengers disappear for Secret Wars after avengers 242… And the wraiths offensive on earth is learned and by the Vision at about the same time in the beginning of avengers 243 shortly after the Avengers disappeared according a talk to the press (page 1). in this same episode of Avengers 243 (page 2) Gyrich and Sykorski travel to New York to discuss the wraiths threat to Vision (Pages 13-14 :4) after Rom talks to Reagan in Rom 53.

So, Rom 52 and 53 take place at the same time at least after the disappearance of the heroes for Secret Wars and just before they come back from Battleworld.and the talk between Gyrich and Sykorski with Vision must occurs to the little gap of the page 14 :4 and 14 :5 of Avengers 243.

Due to the appearance of Dr Strange in Rom 54 and his next appearances in other issues who can’t be moved, the same reasons related to the appearances of Nick Fury in his MCP timeline, and and for reasons of chronological continuity

I have split Rom 54 into 2: pages (1-14) for Dr Strange which keeps his timeline MCP intact

DR STRANGE
DS2 64
ROM 54
DS2 65
DS2 66
IH2 299
IH2 300
IM:LEG 6
IM:LEG 10

and pages (15-22) for Fury although for this one this does not change anything to his MCP chronology

FURY
UX 182
T 341
ROM 53
ROM 54
SECA 5 (1 - 4)-FB
SECA 5 (14:2 - 16:1)-FB
SECA 5 (16:3)-FB
A 245

The reason for all this is related to the chain of events as explained brilliantly by fnord12 in supermegamonkey:

Rom 54 (Pages 15-22) and Rom 55 take place at the same time as avengers 244-245 where the avengers are themselves grappling with wraiths elsewhere.

Rom 54 (Pages 15-22) The Wraith's plot is to unleash mutated blood into the hospital's blood supply. The blood turns anyone who receives it into a monster.
Rom 55 Rick was up for a blood transfusion but luckily the chaos breaks out before he receives it.The Space Knights and SHIELD show up at the hospital too late to do anything but kill all the monsters and neutralize the remaining blood. Rick helps out as much as he can...

Avengers 244-245 Takes place a little before ROM #58 based on references in that issue. Nick Fury appears in this issue, still bandaged from the Dire Wraith attack on the SHIELD helicarrier. I mention this because according to Hulk #297-300, Nick Fury gets run out of SHIELD at some point, as depicted in a non-existent mini-series. Whenever that supposedly happened, it hasn't happened yet.

Reférences : Less than a week ago", the Dire Wraiths attacked the SHIELD helicarrier, in ROM #53.
Nick Fury shows up at the end to tell the Avengers that SHIELD now has the Dire Wraiths on the run, with a reference to "upcoming issues of ROM". I think there's been some kind of miscommunication, or Nick Fury is under the control of Dire Wraith sorcery, or he's just playing a turf war with the Avengers (The Vision is upset that he can't take the lead in the anti-invasion effort due to his own machinations), because Fury's statement just isn't true. But maybe this is why they only bother to send Ant-Man when they get a call from Rick Jones asking for help in ROM #58.


Rom 56-57 This arc begins with Rick Jones still at the hospital that the Dire Wraiths attacked in the previous two issues. ROM and Starshine are gone at this point, but Rick is hanging out with the SHIELD agents. It's not clear why SHIELD hasn't kicked him out or sequestered him or something; presumably he has some kind of Avengers security clearance. But that raises the question of why the Avengers aren't getting called in for stuff like this. To be fair, the Avengers will be dealing with the Dire Wraiths in Avengers #244, which would be happening more or less concurrently with these issues, but that plotline is actually kind of tangential to the Wraith scheme; what we have here is much more tangible.
After the opening scene, we have a two-parter with Alpha Flight. The Dire Wraiths are taking advantage of the water pollution in a Canadian coal mining town in Ontario. They mix their sorcery with the pollution to cause salmon eggs to hatch odd monsters.

Rom 58 -59 Takes place soon after ROM #57. Alpha Flight is still on the scene, getting patched up. But there's been enough time for Rick Jones to arrive, and he's called the Avengers, who sent Ant-Man. If i understand the sequence correctly, Avengers #244-245, which has the Avengers facing Dire Wraiths, takes place concurrently with ROM #55-56. Then Rick Jones arrives in Ontario, calls the Avengers, and explains the new situation, leading them to send in Ant-Man.

which gives that as modifications:

Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Deadpool’s Secret Secret Wars 1-2
Deadpool’s Secret Secret Wars 3 (1)
Marvel Super-Heroes Secret Wars 12 (1 - 2)
Deadpool’s Secret Secret Wars 3 (2 - 20)
Deadpool’s Secret Secret Wars 4 (1 - 8)
Marvel Super-Heroes Secret Wars 12 (3 - 20)
Marvel Super-Heroes Secret Wars 12 (21 - 34) ~ Deadpool’s Secret Secret Wars 4 (9 -17)
Marvel Super-Heroes Secret Wars 12 (35 - 43) ~ Deadpool’s Secret Secret Wars 4 (18 - 19)
Rom 52 *Move to Here *
Rom 53 *Move to Here *

Fantastic Four 265/2 (1 - 7:2)
Avengers 243 (1 - 14:4)
Amazing Spider-Man 252 (1 - 7) ~ Avengers 243 (14:5 - 15) ~ Fantastic Four 265/2 (7:3 - 7:6) ~ Code of Honor 3 (38:3)
Amazing Spider-Man 252 (8) ~ Marvel Team-Up 141 (13 - 14:3)
Incredible Hulk 295 (1 - 2)
Avengers 243 (16) ~ Iron Man 182 (16 - 17:1) ~ Fantastic Four 265/2 (8:1 - 8:2)
Fantastic Four 265/2 (8:3 - 11)
Avengers 243 (17)
Code of Honor 3 (39)
Incredible Hulk 295 (3 - 11)
Deadpool’s Secret Secret Wars 4 (20 - 21)
Amazing Spider-Man 252 (9)
Iron Man 182 (17:2 - 21)
Avengers 243 (18 - 22)
Uncanny X-Men 181 (1 - 20:2)
Uncanny X-Men 182
Amazing Spider-Man 252 (10 - 22)
Peter Parker, the Spectacular Spider-Man 90 (19:4 - 22)
Peter Parker, the Spectacular Spider-Man 91 (1 - 4)
Uncanny X-Men 181 (20:3 - 24)
Marvel Team-Up 141 (14:4 - 21)
New Mutants 17 (10 - 22)
Marvel Team-Up 141 (22)
Fantastic Four 266-268
Code of Honor 3 (40 - 44)
Iron Man 182 (22)
Marvel 1985 1-5
Marvel 1985 6 (1 - 19)
Rom 52 *Move from Here *
Incredible Hulk 295 (12 - 22)
Incredible Hulk 296
Thor 385
Amazing Spider-Man 253 (1 - 11:4)
Peter Parker, the Spectacular Spider-Man 91 (5 - 22)
Amazing Spider-Man 253 (11:5 - 23)
Daredevil 207
Uncanny X-Men 183
Doctor Strange 64
Thor 341 (3 - 22)
Thor 342-344
Rom 53 *Move from Here *
Rom 54 (1-14) (Dr Strange)
Rom 54 (15-22) *Move from Here * Rom 55 *Move from Here *
Daredevil 208-211
New Mutants 18 (1 - 10)
Firestar Mini-Series 2 (1 - 12:3)
Power Man & Iron Fist 108-109
Doctor Strange 65-66
Incredible Hulk 297-300 [Hulk Banished by Dr Strange]
Savage Hulk 5-6
Amazing Spider-Man 254
Power Man & Iron Fist 110
Rom 56-57 *delete*
Alpha Flight 9-10
Rom 54 (15-22) *Move to Here *
Rom 55 *Move to Here *

Avengers 244-245
Rom 56-59
Iron Man 183-185
Iceman Mini-Series 1-4
User avatar
StrayLamb
Director
Director
Posts: 2303
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:42 am
Location: a sheep paddock, along the Great Eastern Highway

Re: Chronology: Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Post by StrayLamb »

I've updated the list with Frank's suggestions for Rom placements, as well as moving the Symbiote Spider-Man issues to before Spectacular Spider-Man 93, and i've added in Daredevils 1-11 & Mighty World of Marvel Magazine 7-16, replacing X-Men Archives featuring Captain Britain. Latest updates are in bold.
Out in the Land Down-Under, beneath a rocky outcrop, deep within the back paddock, dwells the Stray Lamb.
Frank
Big Bad
Big Bad
Posts: 150
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2018 3:32 am

Re: Chronology: Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Post by Frank »

hi Straylamb ;) i suggest moving Vision and scarlet Witch 7 from the bottom of the list to Daredevil 229 level. this is a christmas story :wink:

https://www.cbr.com/totally-tubular-80s ... dar-day-6/
User avatar
StrayLamb
Director
Director
Posts: 2303
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:42 am
Location: a sheep paddock, along the Great Eastern Highway

Re: Chronology: Marvel Super-Heroes Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Post by StrayLamb »

Thanks Frank! Specifically, VIS&SCRW2 7 is set on the Winter Solstice, Dec 21. That means this issue should be placed prior to SECWARSII 9 for Vision & Scarlet Witch. Nothing connects this issue with SECWARSII 9, and there's no reason it can't be moved up.

How's this look.?

---
Secret Wars II 8 (1-13)
Marvels: Eye of the Camera 4 (?? - ??)
Secret Wars II 8 (14-26:6)
New Mutants 37
Vision & Scarlet Witch 7 [Winter Solstice, Sunday December 21]
Amazing Spider-Man 274
Peter Parker, the Spectacular Spider-Man 112 (1-16:7) [Christmas Eve]
Daredevil 229 [Christmas Eve]
Peter Parker, the Spectacular Spider-Man 112 (16:8-22) [Christmas Morning]
Incredible Hulk 314 (1-7)
Incredible Hulk Annual 14
Incredible Hulk 314 (8-22)
Incredible Hulk 315-316
Daredevil 230 [Friday January 2]
Fantastic Four 287
West Coast Avengers 8-9
Cloak & Dagger II 5
X-Factor 1
Power Pack 21
Amazing Spider-Man 275
Amazing Spider-Man 276 (1-21)
Code of Honor 4
Secret Wars II 8 (26:7-27)
Avengers 265
Uncanny X-Men 203
Fantastic Four 288
Secret Wars II 9
Avengers 266
****************
Out in the Land Down-Under, beneath a rocky outcrop, deep within the back paddock, dwells the Stray Lamb.
Frank
Big Bad
Big Bad
Posts: 150
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2018 3:32 am

Re: Chronology: Marvel Super-Heroes Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Post by Frank »

That's look fine :thumbsup:
User avatar
StrayLamb
Director
Director
Posts: 2303
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:42 am
Location: a sheep paddock, along the Great Eastern Highway

Re: Chronology: Marvel Super-Heroes Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Post by StrayLamb »

Thanks everyone - list updated. :thumbsup:
Out in the Land Down-Under, beneath a rocky outcrop, deep within the back paddock, dwells the Stray Lamb.
Leoparis
Chronology Guru
Chronology Guru
Posts: 1443
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2007 6:32 am
Location: Paris
Contact:

Re: Chronology: Marvel Super-Heroes Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Post by Leoparis »

Doctor Strange 71-73
New Defenders 146 (7 - 22)
Doctor Strange & Sorcerers Supremes 5-FB
New Defenders 147-150
Doctor Strange 74
...
Uncanny X-Men 201 (1 - 5)
X:EXTRNTD /2
XCAL 64 (2:5)-FB
Uncanny X-Men 201 (6 - 22)
User avatar
StrayLamb
Director
Director
Posts: 2303
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:42 am
Location: a sheep paddock, along the Great Eastern Highway

Re: Chronology: Marvel Super-Heroes Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Post by StrayLamb »

Updates in BOLD from recent forum posts.
Out in the Land Down-Under, beneath a rocky outcrop, deep within the back paddock, dwells the Stray Lamb.
User avatar
StrayLamb
Director
Director
Posts: 2303
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:42 am
Location: a sheep paddock, along the Great Eastern Highway

Re: Chronology: Marvel Super-Heroes Secret Wars to Secret Wars II

Post by StrayLamb »

Updates posted in BOLD.
Out in the Land Down-Under, beneath a rocky outcrop, deep within the back paddock, dwells the Stray Lamb.
Post Reply