Placement of Savage Hulk (1996)

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Leoparis
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Placement of Savage Hulk (1996)

Post by Leoparis »

In the present framing sequence of this anthology, the intelligent Hulk is under trial. The most recent villain present is Piecemeal (from IH2 403-408) and the most recent information is that Marlo Chandler and Rick Jones are married (from IH2 418). From 427 to 436, where Hulk is attacked by the army, he has been living in hiding in Sunville, Florida with Betty. So having him stand trial while authorities cannot locate him is odd. So this is either before relocating to Sunville in 427 or after they're found by the army in 436. We also cannot push it too far as Stark becomes unavailable in Avengers; The Crossing. In issue 437, published on the same month as Savage Hulk, writer Peter Davis does mention a possible trial (cross-promoting the special):
Senator Ralston, "That annoying Constitution won't allow it without due process."
Matt Talbot, "You mean a trial?"

At the end of 436, it is seen that when the intelligent Hulk gets angry he turns into Banner's body with the angry child Hulk's mind. When Banner calms down, he turns back into the intelligent Hulk.
In 438 the Hulk is still intelligent but shrapnel in his brain makes him unstable.
The Avengers' appearances in IH2 439-440 have been placed after the Crossing--after the death of the adult Stark--so SAVH needs to take place before these issues.

My suggestion is that there is a break in IH2 437 between pages 6 and 7 (or 10:3 and 10:4). The angry Banner has calmed down and faces trial and the Leader launches an attack at the trial to overwhelm him and turn him into weak Banner so he does not interfere with his latest plan. The Leader in CEDGE is not just a dream but a mental attack and requires a listing.

Note: You could have this issue in the six months break between IH2 426 and 427, but that would require changing many more chronologies than these three. It would also have the authorities envisage a trial in 437 after such a case had been dismissed before 427.

Suggested corrections:
HULK/DR. ROBERT BRUCE BANNER
PRIMEV.IH 0
*SAVH move from here
OEDGE 3
IH2 435
DOCSAM 1
IH2 436
CEDGE
*IH2 437 (1 - 6) break here
*SAVH move here
*IH2 437 (7 - 22)

BANNER, BETTY ROSS TALBOT
DCV.M/ 4-BTS
*SAVH move from here
OEDGE 3
IH2 435
IH2 436
*IH2 437 (1 - 6) break here
*SAVH move here
*IH2 437 (7 - 22)

LEADER II/SAM STERNS
IH2 400
IH2 436
*CEDGE add
*SAVH add
IH2 437
Last edited by Leoparis on Mon Sep 20, 2021 6:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.
dimadick
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Re: Placement of Savage Hulk (1996)

Post by dimadick »

Leoparis wrote: Wed Aug 11, 2021 7:07 pm LEADER II/SAM STERNS
IH2 400
IH2 436
*CEDGE add
*SAVH add
IH2 437
Some observations on the Leader's status.
*In IH2 436, the Leader is apparently a disembodied entity. His spirit possesses the body of Omnibus/Burt Horowitz. Omnibus has by this point infiltrated the United States Army. Omnibus is secretly orchestrating events, while using the new alias of Lieutenant Dallas.
*In IH2 437, the President of the United States wishes for the captive Hulk to get a fair trial. Omnibus manipulates Matt Talbot into allowing him a leave from duty, then drives away. Omnibus and the Leader are still struggling over control of their shared body.
*In IH2 438, Omnibus is in a secret facility in Alberta. Omnibus is revealed as the leader of the Alliance, an organization which wants to cause a nuclear war. Omnibus causes bomb explosions in Mount Rushmore and the Great Wall. Omnibus' body then transforms into the Leader's form.
*In IH2 439, Omnibus causes bomb explosions on the World Trade Center and the White House. The Hulk arrives at Omnibus' facility, demanding access to the Leader's equipment. Omnibus offers hospitality to the Hulk, but claims to be unaware where the Leader kept the equipment which the Hulk needs. Hulk leaves and decides to impersonate the Maestro. He publicly claims to be the leader of the Alliance, and is confronted by the Avengers.
*In IH2 440, Omnibus watches a televised battle between the Hulk and Thor. He thinks that Hulk's actions help his plan instead of hindering it. He is then confronted by a revolt of the people of the Freehold, who do not agree with Omnibus' plans. The Hulk is seemingly killed by a nuclear bomb.
*In IH2 441, Omnibus is placed on trial by the people of the Freehold, and sentenced to death. On a subplot, one of Omnibus' attacks has opened the grave of Nick Fury. The authorities discover that Fury's remains are missing, and may never have been buried there.
*In IH2 442, Omnibus is in the Arctic, sentenced to freeze to death. The Leader's persona resurfaces and demands obedience from the people of the Freehold. Their captors are instead content to kill both Omnibus and the Leader in a single stroke. A naked Omnibus is later seen trying to survive, but is confronted by a polar bear.

The Leader would not resurface alive until IH3 30 (September, 2001). So any events regarding the leader in SAVH has to at least precede IH 442. And probably would require him to possess Omnibus or someone else, instead of having a body of his own.
Leoparis
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Re: Placement of Savage Hulk (1996)

Post by Leoparis »

Indeed, the Leader's abilities to exist as a disembodied entity, to invest the Hulk's mind and to take control of Gamma mutates and modify their shape have all been in display in Immortal Hulk and are a major reason for adding these appearances.

The Leader's appearance at a time he was supposed to be dead had been mentioned earlier in 2019.

I agree with dimadick that his appearance in SAVH is necessarily him occupying Omnibus's body. It's tricky because it is not obvious from SAVH that the body we see is Omnibus's. Omnibus is not behind the scenes nor off-panel either. I opted for referring to an issue (IH2 438) where we see Omnibus turning into Leader as evidence for Leader occupying Omnibus's body. (Omnibus also turns physically into the Leader in 439.)

Omnibus's alias needs to be corrected.

And Ralston is missing lines for his appearances in IH2 437 & 439.

With the breaking of IH2 437 in two parts, the Alliance terrorist actions on the first pages warrant a bts line for Omnibus and Leader.

Note: The mistake in the original analysis was in thinking that Hulk stopped getting smart in IH2 436 and that this Savage Hulk special absolutely had to happen before 436. Hulk is still smart after that, though unstable. It is true that it requires finding a break in the middle of a story but Peter David's reference in IH2 437 makes it easy.

LEADER II/SAM STERNS
IH2 400
IH2 436
**CEDGE add
**IH2 437 (1 - 6)-BTS add
**SAVH add
**IH2 437 (7 - 22) add range
IH2 438
*IH2 439 add
IH2 440

**OMNIBUS/BURT HOROWITZ add real name /LT. DALLAS delete (that's not his name just a mind-controlled puppet)
IH2 345
*IH2 346-FB add
*IH2 346 add
IH2 400
IH2 401
IH2 436
CEDGE
**IH2 437 (1 - 6)-BTS add
**SAVH|cf IH2 438 add
**IH2 437 (7 - 22) add range
IH2 438

RALSTON, ROBERT "REB"
IH2 434
IH2 436
**IH2 437 add
**IH2 439 add
UX 346-BTS

Gamma mutates missed for IH2 346:

HOTSHOT/LOUIS
IH2 345
*IH2 346 add
IH2 366

JAILBAIT/JESS
*IH2 345
**IH2 346 add
IH2 366

OGRESS
IH2 345
*IH2 346 add
IH2 366

SOUL MAN/FATHER JASON MCCALL
IH2 345
*IH2 346 add
IH2 400
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