The post-Inferno to end of the Krakoa era X-titles thread

[Michael]

One thing to note is that Peter refers to this first story in this year's Amazing Spider-Man Annual as occurring "the other day", which means it occurs in between Amazing Spider-Man 35 and 36.

[Clive_Reston]

X-Men #28 is the day after #27, or at least its final scene. (And the Sunfire storyline in X-Men Unlimited Infinity Comic #106-111 is a bridge between the flash-forward in X-Men #24 and this.)

X-Men Red #17 continues on from that; thanks to the cloaked figure at the end of Red #16 (whose identity is revealed here), that issue is also after X-Men #28. (My fellow MCP nerds may also enjoy identifying the sources of the callbacks in the collage sequence of #17.)

X-Force #46 continues directly from #45.

Uncanny Spider-Man #3 seems to be a few days after #2; it's fairly flexible, anyway.

There's a new Firestar storyline that begins with X-Men Unlimited Infinity Comic #112; it's definitely after X-Men #26, and seems to be before #27-28.

Thanos #1 has Tony Stark (in the stealth armor) and Emma Frost, likely somewhere in this period. I'll keep an eye on it to see where it might fit.

[Michael]

Note that Animax, Fatale and Reaper appear as Orchis's prisoners in Uncanny Spider-Man 3. Since they were staying in the Limbo Embassy in Dark X-Men 1, Uncanny Spider-Man 3 has to take place after Dark X-Men 1.

[Clive_Reston]

Note that Animax, Fatale and Reaper appear as Orchis's prisoners in Uncanny Spider-Man 3. Since they were staying in the Limbo Embassy in Dark X-Men 1, Uncanny Spider-Man 3 has to take place after Dark X-Men 1.

Fatale and Reaper also turn up as Orchis's hounds in Astonishing Iceman 4, in which Toomes is dismissed (so it should most likely be after Uncanny Spider-Man 3, in which Toomes is still apparently part of Judas Traveller's crew), and in a flashback in which they've gotten beaten up ("some don't have enough sense to stay put"), footnoted to Uncanny Spider-Man, in Dark X-Men 4.

There seems to be a significant break between Dark X-Men 3 and 4. and between Astonishing Iceman 3 and 4. [ETA: as Michael points out below, nope!]

Jean Grey 4 concludes that miniseries and appears to lead into next week's Immortal X-Men 17. It's a White Hot Room thing, so time is all wibbly-wobbly.

Alpha Flight 4 follows immediately from Alpha Flight 3; Uncanny Avengers 4 can't be more than a few hours after Uncanny Avengers 3.

Children of the Vault 4 concludes that miniseries, and nope, it's not a simulation; seems like the whole thing probably takes place over the course of the ten-week gap after the Gala.

[Midnighter]

Immortal Thor 4 (and the brief appareance of Ororo at the end of issue 3) seems to take place during the Genesis War, without further indications. I'd say before X-Men Red 17.

[Michael]

Fatale and Reaper also turn up as Orchis's hounds in Astonishing Iceman 4, in which Toomes is dismissed (so it should most likely be after Uncanny Spider-Man 3, in which Toomes is still apparently part of Judas Traveller's crew), and in a flashback in which they've gotten beaten up ("some don't have enough sense to stay put"), footnoted to Uncanny Spider-Man, in Dark X-Men 4.

I didn't assume Toomes was dismissed, just that he was told he wouldn't have any further part in hunting iceman. The solicits say he'll appear in Uncanny Spider-Man 5. But yes, Fatale and Reaper are turned into hounds in Uncanny Spider-Man 3, so Astonishing Iceman 4 has to take place after Uncanny Spider-Man 3.

Another thing to note is that in X-Men 28, Moira, Nimrod and Karima are surprised when Firestar tells them Mystique is alive. But in Uncanny Spider-Man 3, the hounds encounter Mystique, so ideally, X-Men 28 should take before Uncanny Spider-Man 3.

There seems to be a significant break between Dark X-Men 3 and 4. and between Astonishing Iceman 3 and 4.

Huh? Astonishing Iceman 3 ends with Bobby finding out Peter is being attacked by Feral. Issue 4 starts with Bobby coming to Peter's aid.

Another continuity note- Uncanny Avengers 4 confirms that Captain Krakoa is Hydra Cap, not William Burnside. But in issue 1, Stasis speaks as if Hydra Cap died (in issue 8 of Coates' Cap run) before the founding of Krakoa. So issues 1-8 of Coates' Cap run have to take place before the founding of Krakoa.

[Clive_Reston]

Thank you, Michael!

Here's an attempt at figuring out how the period after Sins of Sinister seems to work, after the timeline resets. As always, any corrections and "what are you EVEN THINKING"s that anyone has are very welcome.

BETWEEN SINS OF SINISTER AND DARK WEB:
(last scenes of SoS: Dominion 1)
X-Men: Before the Fall - Heralds of Apocalypse 1
Immortal X-Men 11 (1-18)
Events *very much* like those of Legion of X 7 (pages 15-20) and Legion of X 8-10 happen here (with some differences; no Vox Ignis, Xavier recognizes Mother Righteous, etc.)
X-Men: Before the Fall - Sons of X 1 (1-27)
X-Men Unlimited Infinity Comic 86-91 (Kurt still on Council; here for the sake of consecutive numbering....)
X-Men: Before the Fall - Sons of X 1 (28-30)
X-Men Red 11
Immortal X-Men 11 (19-20)
X-Men Red 12
X-Men Annual 1 (after AXE; Magik in new armor)
X-Men 15-17 (Magik in new armor)
X-Men 18 (1-18) (X-Terminators are together & think of the name; Beast with one eye)
Wolverine 27 (4-20, present-day bits), 28, 29 ("weeks" and then "days" have passed since the bulk of 26; Deadpool still in X-Force; Beast builds skull HQ)
X-Force 34-38 (Beast has skull HQ, Deadpool still in X-Force)
Wolverine 29 (last scene), 30, 31
Wolverine 32-34/X-Force 39-42 (neither Sinister nor Kurt on the Council)
Wolverine 35
New Mutants 29 (Daken/Scout/Warpath one-off)
New Mutants 30 (Magik in new armor, Deadpool kicked off Krakoa)
Deadpool 1-5
Marvel's Voices: X-Men (5th story, with Lady Deathstrike and Jubilee... maaaaybe?)
Deadpool 6-10
Free Comic Book Day 2022: Spider-Man/Venom (first story, some time after NM 25-28 because of Madelyne)
New Mutants 31-33 (Escapade has been on Krakoa for a few weeks)
Love Unlimited: Karma In Love Infinity Comic #31-36 (we finally see Tran; Sam, Dani and Kate are all around, but given that, can be anywhere around here)

then DARK WEB, which is specifically circa Dec. 13 in a way that probably can't be a topical reference

BETWEEN DARK WEB AND THE 2023 GALA:
Dark X-Men 1/2 (pp. 1-6) (Fenris at the Limbo Embassy)
Bishop: War College 1-5 (at some point after Marauders 7-10; Fenris enter the Pit)
Marvel's Voices: Pride 2023 (7th story; 8th story, after War College 5)
Dark X-Men 1/2 (pp. 7-10; overlaps with M/V:P2023/8)
Mighty Marvel Holiday Special: Iceman's New Year's Resolution Infinity Comic #1 (because this New Year's Eve, Christian is alive and Bobby's not busy terraforming Mars...)
Captain Marvel 43-48 (Rogue & Gambit on Earth, and then in space with Young Laura, Polaris, Kwannon, Armor; more or less simultaneous with X-Men 19-21)
X-Men 18 (19-20), 19-21 (Cyclops appears to be here after the beginning of Captain Marvel 43; Talon, Forge, Magik present)
Captain Marvel 49
Marvel's Voices: X-Men (3rd and 4th stories, with Iceman on Arakko)
Betsy Braddock: Captain Britain 1-5 (it's "months" after Knights of X)
Scarlet Witch 3 (with Polaris)
Love Unlimited: Gwenpool Infinity Comic #43-48 (Wither and Elixir appear)
X-Men Unlimited Infinity Comic 92-95 (with the Fantastic Four)
X-Men Unlimited Infinity Comic 96-99 (Polaris)
X-Men Unlimited Infinity Comic 100 ("5 weeks" before the Gala)
X-Men: Unforgiven 1 (Jubilee, Rogue, Jean, Logan appear; the Treehouse is a thing)
X-Men Annual 1 (2023) (and the rest of Contest of Chaos)
Marvel's Voices Infinity Comic 70 (part 1: Miles Morales, "a month" before the Gala)
X-Men Unlimited Infinity Comic 101 ("4 weeks" before the Gala)
Invincible Iron Man 4-6
X-Men Unlimited Infinity Comic 102 ("3 weeks" before the Gala)
New Mutants: Lethal Legion 1-5
Wolverine 33 (2nd story)
Rogue & Gambit 1-5 (after X-Men Red 10, X-Men 16 and Captain Marvel 49; Lady Deathstrike and Reuben Brousseau both appear)
X-Men Unlimited Infinity Comic 103 ("2 weeks" before the Gala)
X-Men 22
Invincible Iron Man 7 (Stark Sentinels)
Red Goblin 5 (Stark Sentinels)
Carnage 14 (Stark Sentinels)
X-Men Red 16/2 (Sunspot and Shark-Girl, definitely before the Gala)
X:HG2023 (1) -FB --"X weeks ago," before X6 23
X-Men: Before the Fall - Mutant First Strike 1
X-Men 23 (very soon after Amazing Spider-Man 26)
Fallen Friend: The Death of Ms. Marvel 1 (Cyclops appears, being smug)
X-Men Unlimited Infinity Comic 104 ("1 week" before the Gala)
ASM Annual 1 (2023) (second story) (Krakoan medicines are going wrong, Gala hasn't happened yet)
X-Men: Before the Fall - The Sinister Four 1 (Stasis and Righteous's date)
Immortal X-Men 12
Uncanny Avengers 1 (1 - 3 -FB) - "Captain Krakoa" revived
X-Men Red 13 (civil war starts on Arakko)
Immortal X-Men 13 (after Bishop: War College; Fenris in the Pit)
X-Men 24 (1-19) (the day before the Gala)

HELLFIRE GALA 2023 AND IMMEDIATELY AFTER

IIM4 8 (1-2) --Tony and Jen Walters, the afternoon of Gala day
Marvel's Voices Infinity Comic 70 (part 2: Miles Morales, a few hours before the Gala)
X-Force 43 (1-9)--shortly before the Gala
X:HG2023 (2-5) --very shortly before the Gala
X-Force 43 (10-13)--the Gala is beginning
FCBD2023:A/X (1) --break-in at the Treehouse
X:HG2023 (6-9) --early at the Gala, Cyclops responds to the alarm, Destiny and Mystique arrive
FCBD2023:A/X (2) --Destiny and Mystique leave (see note below)
FCBD2023:A/X (3-8) --Cyclops thrown off Treehouse as it starts to burn, Captain Krakoa suit stolen
TIMELESS2 (13) -FF --Treehouse burning
X:HG2023 (10-13) --Xavier, Ms. Marvel, Rogue, Captain Marvel, Rasputin IV, G.O.D.S., Magik at Gala
FCBD2023:A/X /2 (1-2) --Captain Krakoa attack in Washington
IIM4 8 (3) --Tony hears about the Washington attack and suits up
FCBD2023:A/X /2 (3-5) --Steve Rogers attacked in Brooklyn; activates distress beacon
X:HG2023 (14 - 15:5) --Avengers get the signal and depart, immediately followed by Rogue
IIM4 8 (4:1 - 4:2) --Tony hears about both actions and reroutes for Brooklyn
FCBD2023:A/X /2 (6) --Rogue rescues Steve
IIM4 8 (4:3 - 4:5) --Tony, Rogue, Steve
X-Men: Hellfire Gala Last Rites Infinity Comic 1 (aside from its flash-forwards...)
X:HG 2023 (15:6 - 17:3) (the election)
X-Men Unlimited Infinity Comic 105 (Juggernaut)
X:HG 2023 (17:4-19) (Nimrod's attack)
X:HG 2023 (20-31) / X-Force 43 (14-20)
X-Men 26 (1) -FB
X:HG 2023 (32-69)
X6 25 (22:1 - 22:4) -FB is after Forge goes through the gate in X:HG2023
Realm of X 1 is more or less simultaneous with all this
X:HG 2023 (70-71)
X6 25 (28 - 39) -FB are immediately before, during, and immediately after the final scene of X:HG2023.
X6 25 (4 - 5) -FB is very shortly after that.
X6 26 (2 - 3) -FB - Emma and Fisk make a deal
IIM4 8 (5-20) --later that night
IIM4 9 (1-9) --right after that
X-Men Red 14 (1-9) --just after the Gala
Children of the Vault 1 (1-3) --the day after the Gala
X6 25 (22:5) -FB --the Children are annoyed
Realm of X 2 (1-2)
IIM4 9 (10-13)--the day after the Gala
X6 25 (23 - 25) -FB is the day after the Gala (Kamala has been "trapped in the tunnel all day").
FCBD2023: A/X /2 (7-8) --the day after the Gala, Stark Sentinel at Preston house
IIM4 9 (14-20) --that evening
IIM4 10 (9) -FB --Tony talks to Fisk
Amazing Spider-Man Annual 1 (2023) (first story, Limbo Embassy after the Gala)
X-Men Unlimited Infinity Comic 106 (Sunfire... sometime during all this)
Amazing Spider-Man 36 (Annual 1 was "the other day")

DURING THE X-WEEK GAP:

Children of the Vault 1 (3-30) - 4 ("weeks later")
Wolverine/Ghost Rider: Weapons of Vengeance Alpha (present-day sequences)
Ghost Rider 17
Wolverine 36
Wolverine/Ghost Rider: Weapons of Vengeance Omega
Scarlet Witch 6-8 (after the Gala, before Immortal Thor 1)

X WEEKS LATER (note that this is all VERY tentative):

Immortal X-Men 14
X-Men 25 (present-day sequences)
IIM4 10 / X-Men 26 (pp. 11-13 in the former = pp. 19-20 in the latter; let's assume Kamala is visiting the ESU campus before the program starts...)
IIM4 11 (Tony and "Hazel" get married)
Uncanny Avengers 1-4
X-Men Red 14 (10-20), 15
X-Force 44-46 (Deadpool's an Avenger now)
Ms. Marvel: The New Mutant 1-3 (Kamala knows Tony and Emma are married)
Astonishing Iceman 1-2
Dark X-Men 1-3
Alpha Flight 1-4
Uncanny Spider-Man 1-2
Wolverine 37
Realm of X 2 (3 - 20), 3
Immortal X-Men 15-16 / Jean Grey 1-4 (to the extent that the latter is "happening"...)
Wolverine 38 (Uncanny Avengers are up and running)
X-Men Unlimited Infinity Comic 107-111 (Sunfire)
X-Men 24 (20) -FF
X-Men Unlimited Infinity Comic 112-113 (Firestar)
(Storm's appearances in Immortal Thor 3-4 are probably around here)
X-Men 27-28 (end of Sunfire's quest; Nimrod is surprised that Mystique's alive)
Uncanny Spider-Man 3 (hounds encounter Mystique; Fatale and Reaper become hounds)
X-Men Red 16-17 (Sunfire is with Apocalypse)
Astonishing Iceman 3-4 (Fatale and Reaper are hounds)
Dark X-Men 4 (includes a flashback to Fatale and Reaper having escaped & gotten beaten up)

[Midnighter]

Marvel's Voices Infinity Comic 70 is an Hellfire Gala tie-in with Miles Morales set in the days leading up to the afternoon of the Gala (Miles ruins his costume and thus does not participate in the end).

[Clive_Reston]

Marvel's Voices Infinity Comic 70 is an Hellfire Gala tie-in with Miles Morales set in the days leading up to the afternoon of the Gala (Miles ruins his costume and thus does not participate in the end).

Added, thank you!

[Clive_Reston]

This week's Immortal X-Men #17 continues to connect to the end of the Jean Grey miniseries. Uncanny Spider-Man #4 seems to have a break after #3; there's also a note that next week's X-Men Blue: Origins special takes place between pages 16 and 17.

Wolverine #39 is just generally sometime in this period, and guest-stars Black Panther. Jun Wei appears, apparently sometime after X-Force #46.

Invincible Iron Man #12 also follows a break after #11. There's a scene set at "Thanksgiving," which is a topical reference if ever I've seen one. Steve Rogers says "I've had more difficult Thanksgivings. Bastogne in '44 was pretty unpleasant." Have we seen any reference to Steve being present at the Battle of the Bulge before? The Howling Commandos were definitely there... in any case, that battle didn't start until a surprise attack on December 16, so Thanksgiving probably wouldn't have been so bad! Christmas would have been a different story...

[Leoparis]

Steve Rogers says "I've had more difficult Thanksgivings. Bastogne in '44 was pretty unpleasant." Have we seen any reference to Steve being present at the Battle of the Bulge before? The Howling Commandos were definitely there... in any case, that battle didn't start until a surprise attack on December 16, so Thanksgiving probably wouldn't have been so bad! Christmas would have been a different story...

Thanksgiving of 1944 was on Thursday, Nov 23rd.

IH2 284, although it is mistakenly placed with the Battle of Normandy, takes place during the Battle of the Bulge.

Avengers Classic 5/2 shows Cap & Bucky at Bastogne in the winter of '44.

Other stories set in Winter '44-'45 show Cap close to Germany: CA&BUCKY 623, SW 42-FB, ALLWS:BH 1-FB on Dec 6 '44, CA3 32-FB in Dec 44, WSOL:WK-FB on Christmas Eve 1944, INV3 5 & 7 (?Jan '45). So Duggan is on firm ground here.

Marvel writers tend to follow the progress of American troops after D-Day for their Cap flashbacks.
Timely writers placed Cap's stories in the USA (CAC 44-48, ALLWC 14-15, ALLSC 6-7, USAC 15), which makes a very odd chronology in the index where he keeps jumping continents.

In CA:REBORN 2 (7) Cap visits FDR and is back in CA&BUCKY 623 (although they've been placed at different spots).

In USAC 15 (Spring '45, released Feb 25) Cap is coming home on furlough.

In CA 616/4-FB (March 45), he's in Massachussetts. Per Baron Blood's chronology Ruins of Ravencroft Dracula should take place in Feb or Mar '45 for Cap. In XCLUB 4-FB he's also in the Atlantic off Brazil (early 45).

So there are at least these two spots (late '44, Feb-March '45) to place the Timely stories.

[Michael]

BTW, should Wolverine 38 takes place after Immortal X-Men 17? At the end of Immortal X-Men 17, Xavier leaves Krakoa,which he's been defending, to try to find a way to stop the Dominion. Wolverine 38 involves the theft of artifacts from Krakoa, including Cy-Cat and Professor Plod, who appeared in issue 16.

[Clive_Reston]

BTW, should Wolverine 38 takes place after Immortal X-Men 17? At the end of Immortal X-Men 17, Xavier leaves Krakoa,which he's been defending, to try to find a way to stop the Dominion. Wolverine 38 involves the theft of artifacts from Krakoa, including Cy-Cat and Professor Plod, who appeared in issue 16.

Maybe! I'm reserving judgment on that for the moment--I suspect the end of Fall of X may make it a little clearer what's when. (And we've seen Tony filching stuff from Krakoa, so... perhaps that's happened at other times too? I also figure there's been more than one Cy-Cat and Prof. Plod.)

[Midnighter]

From the previews of next week's albums, there will be a lot to work with...
Thor appears in the first few pages of Realm of X 4 in the costume from the previous series, while reverting to the classic costume before Immortal Thor 1 (between the first and second story of the Annual).
Which cascades also involves the placement of the events of Avengers Inc. (issue 3 takes place at the same time as Immortal Thor 1) and Avengers (Thor's costume change takes place between Avengers 2 and 3, also consistent with the Iron Man's armor).
Consequently, this appearance of Black Panther in Wolverine could also be placed earlier between Avengers 2 and 3 and thus before the start of the current series.
The first issue of Avengers Inc. however, which directly follows the end of the Wasp miniseries, should take place before the Hellfire Gala, as a mutant like Whirlwind simply ends up in prison.
Amazing Spider-Man: Gang War First Strike will likely reconstruct the last months of Miles Morales and Peter Parker, who are expected to have crossed paths at Kamala Khan's funeral (before the Hellfire Gala), as Miles chides Peter for not being in touch for months (but could the events of Kamala's death have been erased from Miles' mind?).
Given Spidey's assiduous presence in the various mutant series, it will also be useful to understand his chronology (given that surely part of Gang War will take place after Typhoid Mary returns to Earth, thus after Realm of X).

[Michael]

More on this next week, but Peter and Miles were shown working together in issue 10 of the current Amazing series. I don't think that Miles means he literally hasn't seen Peter since Beyond- he means that Peter disappeared after he broke up with MJ for six months and they haven't had much contact since.